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Post by beeje13 on Aug 21, 2017 16:57:53 GMT
I think it's probably better to look at high yield if you're looking at corporate bond funds the higher yield lessons the impact of the fee.
Has anybody here ever been invested in a private equity Investment Trust? Could be something to consider.
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macq
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Post by macq on Aug 21, 2017 17:22:16 GMT
I think it's probably better to look at high yield if you're looking at corporate bond funds the higher yield lessons the impact of the fee. Has anybody here ever been invested in a private equity Investment Trust? Could be something to consider. have invested in Pantheon IT for a few years -have done well so far and there are a couple of other trusts probably doing better so they can be a good buy.Most come with big discounts even while having big gains (most took a big hit in 2008 so they are considered higher risk) would say its more a choice to hold for a few years so may suit a pension and may be less stress then a venture capital investment in my opinion. Also just noticed there was a feature in the Telegraph in June this year on PE IT's.Was also going to mention that Money observer magazine does a quarterly free mag on investment trusts with its magazine but noticed this months issue also has a feature called income outside the box on P2P & property etc so thats my lunch time reading in Smiths sorted 
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Post by martin44 on Aug 21, 2017 18:26:31 GMT
There is.. and i did it (again) end of 2016 .. liquidated a lump from ss and bought a run down property .. spruced it up and made 18% in 8 months ... only downside was i had to do some physical work.. not recommended when all you want to do is earn money for key punching. 😀
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yangmills
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Post by yangmills on Aug 21, 2017 20:51:07 GMT
I think it's probably better to look at high yield if you're looking at corporate bond funds the higher yield lessons the impact of the fee. ... I would point out that the spread of US, Euro and Sterling High yield (sub-investment grade) bonds to their relevant government bond benchmarks is at historically very tight levels (see link and link). These are the typical bonds that WiseAlpha offers. The credit spread clearly represents the compensation required for default risk. With trailing default rates still at reasonably low levels this tight spread is somewhat justified but it does mean that the bonds could demonstrate serious price declines if those default rates rise (and spreads start to widen).
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macq
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Post by macq on Aug 21, 2017 21:20:57 GMT
the trouble is that there are fears around most forms of investment from politics to interest rates to property & stock market crashes to the death of so called bond proxy stocks that it is a risk being in anything.Guess that's where holding for a long time and taking some profit when you can and drip feeding money in to average it out will help.Would think Wisealpha will say their bonds are safer then some of the high yield bond funds but you hopefully have a manager who understands the market with the funds.Could be my imagination but most of the top bond managers seem to have been around a while so hopefully they have seen it all before
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jaswells
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Post by jaswells on Aug 21, 2017 23:48:18 GMT
The bonds held in the corporate bond funds are often similar to those available on Wisealpha. The difference is often the expansion to overseas bonds which I believe Wisealpha is exploring. Funds can be mismanaged and volatile based on market fluctuations. Wisealpha allows investor flexibility but platform risk remains. Having said that the successful rounds of crowdfunding by Wisealpha make them a stable business proposition for the foreseeable future.
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macq
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Post by macq on Aug 22, 2017 7:22:09 GMT
i am no expert but it is worth bearing in mind with bond funds/trackers that you have the lower risk bond & corporate bond funds verses the higher yielding/strategic funds which tend to be more flexible in what they invest in(and there are even more sub sections).Even within Wisealpha there are 2 sections of bonds of secured & high Yield,hopefully they can stay stable as they expand into Europe.
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Post by stevefindlay on Aug 22, 2017 7:22:57 GMT
If you like the returns from lending, but have concerns about some P2P lending platforms, then you may like to see that we (BondMason) now source over half of our underlying loans from outside the P2P Lending industry. See www.bondmason.com/statistics for details. On average, clients have achieved a gross return of 8.0% or more in each of 2015 (part year), 2016 and 2017 to date. |
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jlend
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Post by jlend on Aug 22, 2017 7:41:31 GMT
I've bought many of the new issues on the London stock exchange ORB bond market over the last few years. The big advantage is that this way you are buying the bonds at par. I've kept most, but sold a few along the way, there is no capital gains tax to pay on listed bonds so any capital gain is tax free. New issues have slowed down a lot though...
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jonno
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nil satis nisi optimum
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Post by jonno on Aug 22, 2017 9:30:30 GMT
I've held Royal London Stirling Extra Yield Bond in my ISA for about five years now. It earns around 6% a year and has grown in value by around 15% as well over the period. Not bad. hopefully you mean one year as its up about 68% over 5 years according to Citywire & Money observer among some sites you can check(15% 1 year & 25% over 3 ) I think you'll find that's the cumulative position. I take the income quarterly and so the gains are not compounded. I switched into mostly Income options following early retirement to try and preserve my previous level of monthly income which has proved mostly successful.
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angrysaveruk
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Post by angrysaveruk on Aug 22, 2017 13:44:33 GMT
One of the things I never liked about P2P platforms is they do not allow you to sell high interest long term loans you have held for a long period of time for a premium. With bonds you can often sell at a premium if you have held them for a period of time because of the upward slope of the yield curve. For example, when I sold out of Rate Setter I had a number of 6% loans with 1 or 2 Years to run well above the current 1 year market rate which in a fair market would have carried a premium above the face value of the loan.
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Nomad
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Post by Nomad on Aug 22, 2017 14:16:07 GMT
One of the things I never liked about P2P platforms is they do not allow you to sell high interest long term loans you have held for a long period of time for a premium. With bonds you can often sell at a premium if you have held them for a period of time because of the upward slope of the yield curve. For example, when I sold out of Rate Setter I had a number of 6% loans with 1 or 2 Years to run well above the current 1 year market rate which in a fair market would have carried a premium above the face value of the loan. Ablrate?
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alender
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Post by alender on Aug 22, 2017 16:16:42 GMT
You could look at Investment trusts specialising in loans which are similar or the same as P2P loans. I have taken an interest as they are generally trading at a discount which more than wipes out the charges.
The ones I know of are:-
P2P Global Investments, yields about 5% are trading at about 14% discount.
Ranger Direct Lending, yields about 12% are trading at about 27% discount.
VPC Specialty Lending Investments , yields about 7% are trading at about 7% discount.
Ranger Direct Lending is probably the most risky and the low price is due to a large loan defaulting so I guess a lack of confidence.
As these also lend outside of the UK there are currency risks.
These can all be held in an ISA, if not in an ISA the income is treated as Income so the first £1000 is tax free (£500 if high rate tax payer) and if you are low paid the fist £6000 is tax free. Low pay is not your total income but money paid as Salary and Pension I believe.
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macq
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Post by macq on Aug 22, 2017 17:03:44 GMT
You could look at Investment trusts specialising in loans which are similar or the same as P2P loans. I have taken an interest as they are generally trading at a discount which more than wipes out the charges. The ones I know of are:- P2P Global Investments, yields about 5% are trading at about 14% discount. Ranger Direct Lending, yields about 12% are trading at about 27% discount. VPC Specialty Lending Investments , yields about 7% are trading at about 7% discount. Ranger Direct Lending is probably the most risky and the low price is due to a large loan defaulting so I guess a lack of confidence. As these also lend outside of the UK there are currency risks. These can all be held in an ISA, if not in an ISA the income is treated as Income so the first £1000 is tax free (£500 if high rate tax payer) and if you are low paid the fist £6000 is tax free. Low pay is not your total income but money paid as Salary and Pension I believe. have looked before but the Ranger direct problems of last year put me off a blt but may be worth another look now.With regards the tax would their dividends not come under the £5000 tax free dividend allowance (£2000 from next April) outside an ISA/Pension?
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jonah
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Post by jonah on Aug 22, 2017 20:07:44 GMT
Dividend allowance was due to be cut in the budget this year. The recent election impacted that, but I wouldn't bet on it not being cut soonish, as there is quite a deficit to fill...
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