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Post by oldnick on May 1, 2014 5:53:00 GMT
As an Englishman living in England I have been scratching my head over the consequences for me of a Yes vote in a referendum that I have no (current) right to vote in. Putting aside the question of my bank accounts, pensions and investments that are with institutions that are registered and, or based in Scotland, I have the issue of loan parts in personal and business loans with individuals and businesses that could potentially end up being foreigners and foreign businesses. So the question is will these continue to be UK loans or are they will they be treated as Overseas loans with the all the consequential tax issues? Looking wider what could the consequences be for P2x platforms that currently don't allows overseas lenders to invest and overseas borrowers to borrow when through events outside their control find themselves with a raft of overseas lenders and borrowers? Back to the beginning. Although the Scottish referendum is perceived as raising thorny questions for p2p/b, the questions are already pertinent in a wider context. A borrower could emigrate to a foreign country that is already in existence during the term of their loan agreement. Does every platform, as part of the loan agreement, insist that, regardless of a borrower's future currency of choice, repayments remain in Sterling? I would have thought so. What if lenders (with a platform in the UK that doesn't allow foreign investors) decide to emigrate and/or change their nationality? Are they required to inform that platform of their changed nationality/country of residence? Do those newly foreign lenders have to sell their loans to satisfy the lender criteria of that platform? Can anybody list the platforms that don't permit foreign investors?
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james
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Post by james on May 1, 2014 15:35:58 GMT
A borrower could emigrate to a foreign country that is already in existence during the term of their loan agreement. Does every platform, as part of the loan agreement, insist that, regardless of a borrower's future currency of choice, repayments remain in Sterling? I would have thought so. Neither the currency in which the payment is made nor the location of the platform makes a difference. What matters is the residence of the payer of the interest at the time the interest payment is made. So sayeth HMRC. I assume that every UK P2x consumer lending platform that has been around for a while is providing their lender customers with incorrect tax statements that don't break down the interest received by country, just because some of the borrowers have moved. Also I assume that most lenders don't even know of the requirements and that they are required to register for self-assessment and complete a tax return if they have received any of this foreign interest. Much rending of hearts to come if the Scottish residents in Scotland vote for Scotland to become independent and thereby vote for most P2x lenders to have to file tax returns. Or HMRC could decide that this is not worth doing and put in a special case rule or law to save themselves and us the cost of them having to deal with lots of new and largely nil extra tax revenue tax returns.
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Post by oldnick on May 1, 2014 16:17:10 GMT
A borrower could emigrate to a foreign country that is already in existence during the term of their loan agreement. Does every platform, as part of the loan agreement, insist that, regardless of a borrower's future currency of choice, repayments remain in Sterling? I would have thought so. Neither the currency in which the payment is made nor the location of the platform makes a difference. What matters is the residence of the payer of the interest at the time the interest payment is made. So sayeth HMRC. True, but my points were related to the impact on the lender in the case where a borrower might have changed their domicile and also wanted to change the currency in which they repaid the loan. Thus creating an added inconvenience for the the lender who would have currency conversions to contend with as well as the unlooked-for foreign earnings issue. The other point was the impact on borrower and platform of a change of domicile. A loan taken out as a resident of the same country as the platform becoming a foreign loan against the rules of that platform.
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agent69
Member of DD Central
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Post by agent69 on May 18, 2014 10:40:08 GMT
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Post by captainconfident on May 18, 2014 18:15:47 GMT
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james
Posts: 2,205
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Post by james on May 19, 2014 1:11:55 GMT
That uses and abuses piece is a good joke. Got to love this bit in particular "The English parliament’s response was stark. The Alien Act said that Scottish nationals in England were to be treated as foreign nationals" given that the Scottish Parliament today is treating Scottish people in England as foreign nationals and refusing them the vote. Seems that the SNP is more than happy to treat Scottish people starkly to try to get what they want. I wonder if those people will also be denied the vote in the next election for government of Scotland if independence happens, so they can use the ballot box to express their thoughts on that?
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Post by captainconfident on May 19, 2014 23:43:28 GMT
Funny thing about coming across that website was the sheer number of similar ones to choose from. Looking for events in which the Scots might be perceived to have been done down in some way seems to have become quite a preoccupation.
I don't think my Scottish grandfather would recognise the tone of victimhood and revelling in historical injustice as his national identity.
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Post by oldnick on May 20, 2014 6:40:44 GMT
Question is, are these contributors players, or are they the back row of extras in an 'Up the Scots' film, with no lines to say, so they're making up for it by waving their spears and gurning a lot with their woad covered faces?
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Post by easteregg on Sept 9, 2014 12:17:05 GMT
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pikestaff
Member of DD Central
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Post by pikestaff on Sept 9, 2014 14:10:17 GMT
easteregg I agree with your blog, as far as it goes. In particular, I agree that "An independent Scotland is unlikely to be able to formally use the Pound, but any Scottish currency is likely to be pegged to Sterling, so any currency exchange risk is likely to be small but probably not zero." I also agree that existing p2p loans in sterling would continue to be repayable in sterling. The contracts cannot be changed retrospectively. The question of future contracts is more interesting. In the absence of p2p platforms north of the border, I'd expect that any new p2p loans would be denominated in sterling and not Scottish currency, because (i) p2p lenders outside Scotland will not want the currency risk, and (ii) most platforms will not want the complication of supporting multiple currencies. This would put the currency exchange FX risk on the borrower, together with whatever bank charges are levied for cross-currency payments. I have a particular concern regarding p2p loans to Scottish wind farms. I expect the subsidy regime to be honoured come what may, but I am uncertain whether some or all of a Scottish wind farm's income streams might be denominated in Scottish currency, which would create additional risk. Moreover, most of these loans are due to be repaid via a refinancing at maturity. Post independence, the refinancing would likely be more difficult and expensive.
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merlin
Minor shareholder in Assetz and many other companies.
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Post by merlin on Sept 9, 2014 15:52:02 GMT
I think the "Sporran" sounds better but have not thought up what the smaller bits could be called?  |
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merlin
Minor shareholder in Assetz and many other companies.
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Post by merlin on Sept 9, 2014 15:55:25 GMT
I think the "Sporran" sounds better but have not thought up what the smaller bits could be called? A lot of us in West Wales are hoping the Scots do vote "NO" then we could welcome the Trident Subs to Milford Haven and all the Sporrans they bring with them!
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Post by oldnick on Sept 9, 2014 16:19:16 GMT
I think it's a YES you'll be hoping for in that case.
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merlin
Minor shareholder in Assetz and many other companies.
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Post by merlin on Sept 9, 2014 17:37:16 GMT
You are dead right I did mean yes.
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Post by batchoy on Sept 10, 2014 19:01:29 GMT
Given the ability of the Scots to hold a grudge (historically misplaced or not) for hundreds of years, whichever way the vote goes there could be long term repercussions within Scotland itself for along time to come.
It was interesting to note during the summer the animosity already driving rifts within a Scottish family we know of where you have the children (16 & 18) holding pro Yes stances but with no real reasoning behind their position, the wife staunchly No on the grounds that she is a small business owner and the Yes campaign had been unable to give concrete answers as to what will happen with currency, economy etc post independence and the Husband who is staunchly Yes based on a Nationalist view backed by a limited and predominantly incorrect view of the relationship between and the powers of the Scottish and Westminster Parliaments plus a general chip on his shoulder about the English.
In terms of outcome for Scotland the worst possible scenario will be an 'No' vote by a very small margin.
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