ceejay
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Post by ceejay on Apr 24, 2018 10:46:19 GMT
Can't say I agree with the idea of making this forum paid-for, or with the idea of paying the mods. Not that I have anything at all against the mods, to be clear - I think they do a great job in difficult circumstances (by which I mean anything on the internet!).
The trouble is that (as research has shown) if you pay people a small amount of money to do work it actually acts as a disincentive. It says that your time is worth something, but not very much. Whereas work done on a voluntary basis generates an entirely different reward: this is how every organisation that uses large numbers of volunteers functions. You're either a volunteer, or on a full salary - no halfway houses.
And I don't like the idea of making platforms pay, either, unless its by clearly identified advertising. If you take any other model then you are creating an expectation of delivering a service TO THEM - it seems that they are hard enough to control as it is, can you imagine how much harder it would be if they grew a sense of entitlement?
I've found this forum to be a hugely helpful resource and would hate to see it disappear just because a few ***** couldn't behave themselves.
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Post by chris on Apr 24, 2018 10:55:20 GMT
dandy - it's still a conflict of interest as we're effectively endorsing forum policy, and mods can still be accused of being influenced by platforms so that they continue to pay to participate. The idea of referrer links is likely a better solution, at least in the short term, and something that would just plumb straight into our existing affiliate program.
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bigfoot12
Member of DD Central
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Post by bigfoot12 on Apr 24, 2018 10:55:25 GMT
I don't think that you can ask the platforms to pay. FC, for examply, could simply close their forum by not contributing, as could any other platform that didn't like the direction of travel. Good luck trying to set up a PM action group on this forum if PM are paying!
I also think that registering identities might be tricky. The platform would then have personal data and DPA and GDPR and all that would become a problem, especially since we don't even know who the mods are.
What about each moderator nominating a favourite charity and those who value this forum can make a donation, and repeat every 12 months?
Edit: made clearer that I mean that a platform could close their section not the whole site.
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dandy
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Post by dandy on Apr 24, 2018 10:55:34 GMT
Can't say I agree with the idea of making this forum paid-for, or with the idea of paying the mods. Not that I have anything at all against the mods, to be clear - I think they do a great job in difficult circumstances (by which I mean anything on the internet!). The trouble is that (as research has shown) if you pay people a small amount of money to do work it actually acts as a disincentive. It says that your time is worth something, but not very much. Whereas work done on a voluntary basis generates an entirely different reward: this is how every organisation that uses large numbers of volunteers functions. You're either a volunteer, or on a full salary - no halfway houses. And I don't like the idea of making platforms pay, either, unless its by clearly identified advertising. If you take any other model then you are creating an expectation of delivering a service TO THEM - it seems that they are hard enough to control as it is, can you imagine how much harder it would be if they grew a sense of entitlement? I've found this forum to be a hugely helpful resource and would hate to see it disappear just because a few ***** couldn't behave themselves. I respect your opinion but have to say I disagree with this entire post if mods prefer to work for free they are perfectly entitled to do so and be incentivised however they currently are. doesn't mean they cant pay other/new mods to help out, or for legal advice, or for rules to be written etc. Platform entitlement will exist (to a separate forum board at a cost of £1,000 per annum). What else exactly would you/they expect to be entitled to?
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dandy
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Post by dandy on Apr 24, 2018 11:05:46 GMT
I don't think that you can ask the platforms to pay. FC, for examply, could simply close the independent forum by not contributing, as could any other platform that didn't like the direction of travel. Good like trying to set up a PM action group on this forum if PM are paying! I also think that registering identities might be tricky. The platform would then have personal data and DPA and GDPR and all that would become a problem, especially since we don't even know who the mods are. What about each moderator nominating a favourite charity and those who value this forum can make a donation, and repeat every 12 months? How could FC (or other platform) close the forum by not contributing? The forum would just not get their annual fee from FC and FC would not have a board
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bigfoot12
Member of DD Central
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Post by bigfoot12 on Apr 24, 2018 11:40:54 GMT
How could FC (or other platform) close the forum by not contributing? The forum would just not get their annual fee from FC and FC would not have a board Which would end all adverse discussion of FC... (Edited my previous post to make my meaning clearer.)
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archie
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Post by archie on Apr 24, 2018 11:46:08 GMT
I think boards should be based on lender need rather than platforms choosing to pay.
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dandy
Posts: 427
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Post by dandy on Apr 24, 2018 11:47:49 GMT
How could FC (or other platform) close the forum by not contributing? The forum would just not get their annual fee from FC and FC would not have a board Which would end all adverse discussion of FC... (Edited my previous post to make my meaning clearer.) Yes I see what you mean. However I dont think that is correct as they could still be discussed in the general forum. They just wouldn't have a separate board and would be a "pariah" platform unwilling to support the p2p community
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dandy
Posts: 427
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Post by dandy on Apr 24, 2018 11:48:47 GMT
anyhow seems I am in a minority (of 1 perhaps) and it won't happen. Oh well.
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Post by Badly Drawn Stickman on Apr 24, 2018 11:50:31 GMT
I may be to blame having suggested there was a potential revenue stream, but money in this instance is an irrelevance. Nobody is asking to be paid.
Arguably the solution is more moderating capacity. Currently the 'Staff' is small and moderates the whole platform. There is no reason why given sufficient volunteers each platform could be covered by a 'platform specific' moderator. That would on most platforms be a relatively small workload.
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Post by Proptechfish on Apr 24, 2018 11:59:37 GMT
Things can easily get out of hand. I stopped/suspended posting on this forum for a while after receiving a couple of PM's requesting I release the DD notes I had carried out on a couple of platforms. I refused and suggested they carried out the DD themselves. The responses were anything but polite and I was accused of being selfish, having a hidden agenda and so on. So I can understand why some folks simply throw in the towel.
I think bearing in mind the work that the admins/mods do there should be some sort of annual honorarium payment made. I know that suggestion won't earn me any brownie points but the amount of information freely made available which often determines whether to invest or not is invaluable IMO. As well as xx members there are usually three times as many guests lurking so somewhere down the line I cannot see how this forum can continue to operate on a free of charge basis.
I agree that there should be a charge. But I think it should be the platforms that pay it. £1,000 annually per platform is not going to break the bank and would give the mods a wholly deserved salary for their management - the platforms benefit immensely from this forum too and from our continued awareness of their existence and offerings I would happily pay a few bob every year to be a member but charging readers could be far more difficult and costly for reasons already stated Totally agree with this sentiment, if a charge is brought in it should be the platform side, not the forum user. That's not because i'm tight, it just makes a lot more sense, and it would remove any platform incentive pushing and put all on a level playing field. Look at the likes of the REC and recruitment industry for how it might work
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bigfoot12
Member of DD Central
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Post by bigfoot12 on Apr 24, 2018 13:59:22 GMT
I agree that paying mods is probably a bad idea, but what about charging for a user's first post? A charge of £5-£10 might be about right. This would:-
a) cut spam down to almost zero,
b) encourage new members to search to see if their question has already been asked (and answered),
c) to post in the correct place, and
d) encourage new members to read some of the rules before posting.
This might help with other problems such as people creating multiple accounts. Money could be used to support the site, given to charity, used to buy awards, to pay for legal advice....
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Apr 24, 2018 14:41:10 GMT
I agree that there should be a charge. But I think it should be the platforms that pay it. £1,000 annually per platform is not going to break the bank and would give the mods a wholly deserved salary for their management - the platforms benefit immensely from this forum too and from our continued awareness of their existence and offerings I would happily pay a few bob every year to be a member but charging readers could be far more difficult and costly for reasons already stated That's a good idea and worth considering, although charging members (even if only a quid) has some advantages .. firstly it does some of the KYC for you (someone who pays probably has provided a paypay/cc/bank account, which means they presumably exist as a real person), and it also may encourage them to avoid getting banished to the outer darkness for acting like an idiot (right now there is very little downside to getting banned .. just change everything and come back with a new name .. or in some cases, two or three). There has been more than one instance of a member pretending to be something/someone they are not (or pretending NOT to be someone they are, which is probably worse).
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bugs4me
Member of DD Central
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Post by bugs4me on Apr 24, 2018 16:14:33 GMT
'.. just change everything and come back with a new name .. or in some cases, two or three). There has been more than one instance of a member pretending to be something/someone they are not (or pretending NOT to be someone they are, which is probably worse)..'
I had to read and re-read this sentence until the rusty penny dropped inside my head 
Early days but assuming a nominal say monthly fee was applied, what, if any, extra work would this idea impose on the admin/mods?
Of course on the other hand if it removed spam, etc then it may lessen the work in the medium term.
No doubt the idea of charging a nominal fee (although this will need to be spelled out) would require a poll somewhere to gauge current members thoughts.
Maybe I've just answered my own question!! - I go away now
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cb25
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Post by cb25 on Apr 24, 2018 16:24:27 GMT
I agree that there should be a charge. But I think it should be the platforms that pay it. £1,000 annually per platform is not going to break the bank and would give the mods a wholly deserved salary for their management - the platforms benefit immensely from this forum too and from our continued awareness of their existence and offerings I would happily pay a few bob every year to be a member but charging readers could be far more difficult and costly for reasons already stated Totally agree with this sentiment, if a charge is brought in it should be the platform side, not the forum user. I disagree with that. As has been mentioned, what happens if a particular platform says "no thanks, it's of no interest to us". Are we going to name & shame them along the lines of "platform XYZ won't fund our forum (where the only thing we do is slag them off)" ? Imo that would be unethical on our (the lenders') part and stepping very close to blackmail ("pay up platform XYZ or we're going to badmouth you").
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