cb25
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Post by cb25 on Jan 29, 2019 10:03:07 GMT
I'm happy to support revisiting each of these - PR and Brexit - each generation or so. When you have the PM now whipping her party to vote to change the deal she personally negotiated 3 months earlier, which she said was not renegotiable and had whipped her party to support but lost in the biggest ever parliamentary defeat in history - I reckon we can revisit it a bit sooner rather than having to wait a generation. If TM can change her mind in 3 months, I reckon we can in 3 years. (Or not of course - we can restate our determination to plough on if we still believe in it after this utter shambles). Here's an interesting compromise on the subject of a second referendum from Roger Bootle of Capital Economics
"... I can advance another suggestion for reducing uncertainty, only half in jest. My proposal is that the Leavers agree to a second referendum provided that two conditions are met. First, we leave on March 29 either with no deal or with the temporary FTA discussed above. Second, the referendum must be held two years after March 29.
Amongst other things, this would solve the vexed issue of the question to be asked in the referendum. It would have to be “Should the UK remain outside the EU or rejoin it?” This has the delicious irony that Leavers would then become Remainers."
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IFISAcava
Member of DD Central
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Post by IFISAcava on Jan 29, 2019 10:32:43 GMT
When you have the PM now whipping her party to vote to change the deal she personally negotiated 3 months earlier, which she said was not renegotiable and had whipped her party to support but lost in the biggest ever parliamentary defeat in history - I reckon we can revisit it a bit sooner rather than having to wait a generation. If TM can change her mind in 3 months, I reckon we can in 3 years. (Or not of course - we can restate our determination to plough on if we still believe in it after this utter shambles). Here's an interesting compromise on the subject of a second referendum from Roger Bootle of Capital Economics
"... I can advance another suggestion for reducing uncertainty, only half in jest. My proposal is that the Leavers agree to a second referendum provided that two conditions are met. First, we leave on March 29 either with no deal or with the temporary FTA discussed above. Second, the referendum must be held two years after March 29.
Amongst other things, this would solve the vexed issue of the question to be asked in the referendum. It would have to be “Should the UK remain outside the EU or rejoin it?” This has the delicious irony that Leavers would then become Remainers."
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Since there isn't a FTA on the table, that leaves no deal. And having to decide between prioritising medicine or food in the event of a no deal (that's not "Project Fear", that's a government minister) is rather more than "interesting" I'd say! If all goes to plan after a no deal exit, we'll have a devastating 2 years (except for the wealthy elite pushing Brexit the hardest) followed by rejoining on the EU's terms and losing all the benefits of our current deal (no Euro, no Schengen, no ever closer union etc).
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Post by captainconfident on Jan 29, 2019 11:51:27 GMT
While I quite like the Roger Scruton suggestion because it would give a proper chance to see what life is like outside the EU, if the referendum was for rejoining, the UK would lose all the exceptions and rebates we currently enjoy and have to rejoin on the more stringent criteria which new applicant countries face. Including having to adopt the Euro. Someone asked for an unbiased account of what "WTO Terms trading would entail, and I think this will do:- brexitfactbase.com/pdfs/UKTradeWTO.pdf
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james100
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Post by james100 on Jan 29, 2019 17:26:15 GMT
Ken Clarke for PM with Yvette Cooper as Home Secretary please. Just putting it out there...
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Jan 29, 2019 17:29:55 GMT
Ken Clarke for PM with Yvette Cooper as Home Secretary please. Just putting it out there... I'd be happy with any capable, sane centrists, that's if there are any. You can drop Corbyn and Bill Cash and their ilk down a very deep hole as far as I am concerned.
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james100
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Post by james100 on Jan 29, 2019 18:25:03 GMT
Ken Clarke for PM with Yvette Cooper as Home Secretary please. Just putting it out there... I'd be happy with any capable, sane centrists, that's if there are any. You can drop Corbyn and Bill Cash and their ilk down a very deep hole as far as I am concerned. We can blend it to the centre, sure: David Milliband (returns) for Business Caroline Lucas for Environment Heidi Allen for Transport Nick Clegg (returns) for Foreign Office Jo Swinson for Women & Equalities David Lammy for Housing Nicola Sturgeon for having Very Big Balls Corbyn can fight Rees-Mogg over who gets to manage/work the parliamentary allottment which shall be the only source of fruit and vegetables permitted inside HoC restaurants henceforth. That should focus their minds on collective responsibility for a change and starve the less committed MPs out.
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Post by martin44 on Jan 29, 2019 20:59:27 GMT
Well well well... a very nice evening in parliament tonight i feel a lot more confident brexiteer..
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Post by martin44 on Jan 29, 2019 21:02:57 GMT
Ken Clarke for PM with Yvette Cooper as Home Secretary please. Just putting it out there... the next prime minister will be Michael Gove.......... nailed on.
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registerme
Member of DD Central
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Post by registerme on Jan 29, 2019 21:59:51 GMT
Well, my twenty or thirty good friends who happen to be European are a) shaking their heads in bewilderment and b) laughing (at us).
The EU isn't going to back down, not one inch.
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ozboy
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Mine's a Large One! (Snigger, snigger .......)
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Post by ozboy on Jan 29, 2019 22:28:19 GMT
The amateurs who are/were "negotiating" were/are useless, every one of them.
As I've said before, Maggie would not only have got everything we want, but probably a Golden Goodbye ta boot!
I am just sooooooooooo bored with it all now.
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Post by martin44 on Jan 29, 2019 22:38:00 GMT
snip The EU isn't going to back down, not one inch. i have a feeling you may be wrong..
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Post by martin44 on Jan 29, 2019 22:42:41 GMT
The amateurs who are/were "negotiating" were/are useless, every one of them. why?
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Post by Badly Drawn Stickman on Jan 29, 2019 22:45:14 GMT
snip The EU isn't going to back down, not one inch. i have a feeling you may be wrong.. You might both be wrong.
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Post by martin44 on Jan 29, 2019 22:47:32 GMT
i have a feeling you may be wrong.. You might both be wrong. feel free to expand..
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Post by Badly Drawn Stickman on Jan 29, 2019 22:52:05 GMT
feel free to expand.. It seems to be customary to have three options in play at any time, i was updating the equation.
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