Godanubis
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Anubis is known as the god of death and is the oldest and most popular of ancient Egyptian deities.
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Post by Godanubis on Feb 6, 2019 18:20:00 GMT
Did you sell them to those guys bothering Anna Soubry? Good grief no, they were far too small for such portly chaps. However if you are making a giant leap and suggesting I would wish her ill, you are a very long way from the mark. Quick get him boys he’s a closet remainer I prefer a nice cerise that’s an nice French derived colour. Keeping with the French theme
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Feb 6, 2019 18:43:01 GMT
This amused me (Bercow today in the Commons):-
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Post by martin44 on Feb 6, 2019 23:49:53 GMT
This amused me (Bercow today in the Commons):- Me too. its been particularly entertaining today... must say i quite liked nigel farage's response ... Heaven
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captainconfident
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Post by captainconfident on Feb 8, 2019 11:13:27 GMT
Keep informed with the latest Brexit blog chrisgreybrexitblog.blogspot.com/"The dispiriting situation is that the UK has now reached a point where, in a sense, it can neither leave the EU nor stay in it. That is to say, there is currently no viable route to get to ‘remain’ but even if there were then what kind of EU member would the UK then be? On the other hand, there is no way of delivering Brexit which any but a tiny minority of Brexiters regard as satisfactory. Ironically, a project cloaked in the sacred cloth of the ‘will of the people’ is going to end up being the will of almost no one". [----------] "For the circles we are going round are not a neat holding pattern, waiting patiently for a safe landing according to known procedures. Rather, Britain is in a vicious tailspin, almost out of fuel, and plummeting to the ground. The pilot is frozen in panic, the second pilot is present but not involved, the cabin crew are bickering and the noisiest of the passengers have convinced themselves that the theory of gravity is elitist fear mongering".
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Steerpike
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Post by Steerpike on Feb 8, 2019 12:00:03 GMT
Keep informed with the latest Brexit blog chrisgreybrexitblog.blogspot.com/"The dispiriting situation is that the UK has now reached a point where, in a sense, it can neither leave the EU nor stay in it. That is to say, there is currently no viable route to get to ‘remain’ but even if there were then what kind of EU member would the UK then be? On the other hand, there is no way of delivering Brexit which any but a tiny minority of Brexiters regard as satisfactory. Ironically, a project cloaked in the sacred cloth of the ‘will of the people’ is going to end up being the will of almost no one". [----------] "For the circles we are going round are not a neat holding pattern, waiting patiently for a safe landing according to known procedures. Rather, Britain is in a vicious tailspin, almost out of fuel, and plummeting to the ground. The pilot is frozen in panic, the second pilot is present but not involved, the cabin crew are bickering and the noisiest of the passengers have convinced themselves that the theory of gravity is elitist fear mongering". "The immediate reaction from some Brexiters was to say, at least, that the Nissan decision was only partly to do with Brexit and, at most, that it was nothing whatsoever to do with Brexit. The latter is plainly nonsense. The former is true, but misses the point. Such decisions will almost always be multi-factorial but Brexit weighs them against the UK and does nothing to weigh them in favour of the UK."
The plan to build new X-Trail in Sunderland was made after the result of the 2016 referendum was known, the reversal of the decision was made after sales of X-Trail plummeted, seemingly implying that if Brexit is a factor it is not significant, whereas sales are a big factor. However, these obvious facts don't stop Prof Chris using this as an example of Brexit disaster to rant on and on about all the future catastrophes that will have a similar cause. There isn't a "fundamental flaw in Brexit" as Chris and his chum Tusk assert, the real issue is that contrary to their manifesto promises and parliamentary votes to exit the EU, a significant number of MPs don't want to implement the result of the referendum.
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cb25
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Post by cb25 on Feb 8, 2019 12:05:55 GMT
Keep informed with the latest Brexit blog chrisgreybrexitblog.blogspot.com/"The dispiriting situation is that the UK has now reached a point where, in a sense, it can neither leave the EU nor stay in it. That is to say, there is currently no viable route to get to ‘remain’ but even if there were then what kind of EU member would the UK then be? On the other hand, there is no way of delivering Brexit which any but a tiny minority of Brexiters regard as satisfactory. Ironically, a project cloaked in the sacred cloth of the ‘will of the people’ is going to end up being the will of almost no one". [----------] "For the circles we are going round are not a neat holding pattern, waiting patiently for a safe landing according to known procedures. Rather, Britain is in a vicious tailspin, almost out of fuel, and plummeting to the ground. The pilot is frozen in panic, the second pilot is present but not involved, the cabin crew are bickering and the noisiest of the passengers have convinced themselves that the theory of gravity is elitist fear mongering". "The immediate reaction from some Brexiters was to say, at least, that the Nissan decision was only partly to do with Brexit and, at most, that it was nothing whatsoever to do with Brexit. The latter is plainly nonsense. The former is true, but misses the point. Such decisions will almost always be multi-factorial but Brexit weighs them against the UK and does nothing to weigh them in favour of the UK."
The plan to build new X-Trail in Sunderland was made after the result of the 2016 referendum was known, the reversal of the decision was made after sales of X-Trail plummeted, seemingly implying that if Brexit is a factor it is not significant, whereas sales are a big factor. However, these obvious facts don't stop Prof Chris using this as an example of Brexit disaster to rant on and on about all the future catastrophes that will have a similar cause. There isn't a "fundamental flaw in Brexit" as Chris and his chum Tusk assert, the real issue is that contrary to their manifesto promises and parliamentary votes to exit the EU, a significant number of MPs don't want to implement the result of the referendum. No surprise to me that a Remainer might say "a project cloaked in the sacred cloth of the ‘will of the people’ is going to end up being the will of almost no one".
Huge number of Leavers are saying "bring it on" (even if there's no deal).
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Feb 8, 2019 12:28:52 GMT
"The immediate reaction from some Brexiters was to say, at least, that the Nissan decision was only partly to do with Brexit and, at most, that it was nothing whatsoever to do with Brexit. The latter is plainly nonsense. The former is true, but misses the point. Such decisions will almost always be multi-factorial but Brexit weighs them against the UK and does nothing to weigh them in favour of the UK."
The plan to build new X-Trail in Sunderland was made after the result of the 2016 referendum was known, the reversal of the decision was made after sales of X-Trail plummeted, seemingly implying that if Brexit is a factor it is not significant, whereas sales are a big factor. However, these obvious facts don't stop Prof Chris using this as an example of Brexit disaster to rant on and on about all the future catastrophes that will have a similar cause. There isn't a "fundamental flaw in Brexit" as Chris and his chum Tusk assert, the real issue is that contrary to their manifesto promises and parliamentary votes to exit the EU, a significant number of MPs don't want to implement the result of the referendum. No surprise to me that a Remainer might say "a project cloaked in the sacred cloth of the ‘will of the people’ is going to end up being the will of almost no one".
Huge number of Leavers are saying "bring it on" (even if there's no deal).
That may well be the case, but it is very far from a majority that want to bring on a no deal Brexit. No deal is emphatically not the will of the people. But if there is any doubt, perhaps one can test no deal in a referendum just to make sure?
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cb25
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Post by cb25 on Feb 8, 2019 12:55:23 GMT
No surprise to me that a Remainer might say "a project cloaked in the sacred cloth of the ‘will of the people’ is going to end up being the will of almost no one".
Huge number of Leavers are saying "bring it on" (even if there's no deal).
That may well be the case, but it is very far from a majority that want to bring on a no deal Brexit. No deal is emphatically not the will of the people. But if there is any doubt, perhaps one can test no deal in a referendum just to make sure? Sure, let's leave on a no-deal, then have a referendum and we'll beat you again with a bigger majority.
As we need a government that's (more) aligned with voters' wishes, I think it would be better to leave then have a general election rather than a second referendum. That would have the benefit of the political parties having to make clear(er) their Brexit position and shaking out a few of the MPs in both main parties.
Interesting article by Fraser Nelson in The Telegraph yesterday (https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/02/07/brussels-terrified-brexit-success-no-wonder-threatening-hellfire/) saying that the EU could easily have agreed a deal with May by inserting a break clause in the WA, but instead continues on with the 'exiting the EU must be a nightmare' to keep other countries in line.
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Feb 8, 2019 15:58:42 GMT
That may well be the case, but it is very far from a majority that want to bring on a no deal Brexit. No deal is emphatically not the will of the people. But if there is any doubt, perhaps one can test no deal in a referendum just to make sure? Sure, let's leave on a no-deal, then have a referendum and we'll beat you again with a bigger majority.
As we need a government that's (more) aligned with voters' wishes, I think it would be better to leave then have a general election rather than a second referendum. That would have the benefit of the political parties having to make clear(er) their Brexit position and shaking out a few of the MPs in both main parties.
Interesting article by Fraser Nelson in The Telegraph yesterday (https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/02/07/brussels-terrified-brexit-success-no-wonder-threatening-hellfire/) saying that the EU could easily have agreed a deal with May by inserting a break clause in the WA, but instead continues on with the 'exiting the EU must be a nightmare' to keep other countries in line.
I've always said that a referendum on a specific plan much more powerful than a referendum on a concept - and a two stage referendum - as suggested by the MP for the 18th century JRM - would be unarguable ("but what type of Brexit" etc etc) and the most democratic solution of all. I'd also make it binding so that any significant illegality would invalidate the result this time, as it would have a general election. But if the country voted in a referendum for a no deal exit - full steam ahead.
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Feb 8, 2019 16:42:00 GMT
No deal is emphatically not the will of the people. But it is the fall back position that was supported by an ovewhelming number of MP's (majority in favour nearly 400?)
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Feb 8, 2019 17:09:22 GMT
No deal is emphatically not the will of the people. But it is the fall back position that was supported by an ovewhelming number of MP's (majority in favour nearly 400?) For now. But I expect that to change.
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captainconfident
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Post by captainconfident on Feb 11, 2019 12:18:53 GMT
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Feb 11, 2019 12:47:26 GMT
JRM supported the idea of a two stage referendum process - this would be exactly what he suggested - a referendum on the outcome of two years of negotiations. It would be people's democracy in action. If people say no to TM's deal, rescind A50 and renegotiate over subsequent years for something better OR have a referendum on leaving with no deal. If they say yes, full steam ahead to either of those. How could anyone object?
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cb25
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Post by cb25 on Feb 11, 2019 12:47:59 GMT
From the Daily Mail article above "The new referendum would offer the British people a choice between the Prime Minister's deal and staying in the European Union."
(Edit:) Can't see that going anywhere. MPs have already voted by a large majority against May's deal and the public has voted by a large number against Remain.
Suggest in The Times today (read print edition so no link) suggesting May might agree softer Brexit with Corbyn, keeping the UK in the customs union. That would make the next GE interesting, as some supporters of both parties would find fault with that.
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Feb 11, 2019 12:53:16 GMT
From the Daily Mail article above "The new referendum would offer the British people a choice between the Prime Minister's deal and staying in the European Union."
Fake choice. MPs have already voted by a large majority against May's deal and the public has voted by a large number against Remain.
Real choice, here and now. Arguably the fake choice was the "have cake and eat it" version(s) of Leave offered in the second (2016) referendum. And democracy didn't end in 2016 just as it didn't in 1975!
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