james100
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Post by james100 on Mar 24, 2019 18:27:58 GMT
It's a good example of Great British entrepreneurialism that's for sure. And to anyone interested in financially supporting them (as I have previously), you can still do so here: www.crowdfunder.co.uk/by-donkeys
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Post by bracknellboy on Mar 25, 2019 22:16:19 GMT
IF - and its a very big IF, or indeed a very big IFF - Letwin’s amendment passes, resulting in Parl taking control of the slating of Parl business away from Gov, that is a monumental statement about the disconnect between Exec and Parl. Rumours are that a Gov Min has resigned in order to be able to vote for it (1 defection does not make a spring....).
Interesting times (potential understatement)
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Post by bracknellboy on Mar 25, 2019 22:24:30 GMT
OK, wow. Virtually as soon as I post that, its no longer an IF but rather a “now that”. Big wow. This has to be unprecendted - but entirely constitutional - territory. The really bizarre thing is: if the official opposition were to put a No Confidence motion forward tomorrow I‘m pretty sure it would lose. Parl is genuinely saying that it wants Parl to take control, not the exec. Which of course is its prerogative.
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Mar 25, 2019 22:41:53 GMT
This is going to... take some time to work out. There's potentially interesting ramifications. I mean absent Brexit and in a situation like this we'd have to have a general election no? But a general election now (as I've commented on before) is just a waste of time.....
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Post by mrclondon on Mar 25, 2019 22:52:30 GMT
And now confirmed via 2nd vote on the motion as amended.
Wow indeed, esp the 3 government ministers resigning to support it, but having watched the debate today, once again the government has been flat footed ... having the indicative votes on Wed possibly not the best day from governement's perspective, but they could have set aside another day or days(s) and given parliament the option to debate the process. Instead they just appeared evasive.
What has come across today is this is all about changing the political declaration document to contain a commitment to a soft brexit (e.g. SM+CU) - something the governement can't support without breaking the 2017 manifesto + queens speech. GE beckons (in June) IMO.
BTW the most annoying thing in watching all these debates, is watching Liz Kendall chewing gum hour in hour out. No one else does . Yuk, not a good look.
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Post by bracknellboy on Mar 25, 2019 23:15:48 GMT
In the last exchange that I watched, JC came across as almost statesman like: god help us.....
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rogerthat
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Post by rogerthat on Mar 25, 2019 23:21:55 GMT
Too late now..Letwin's motion just passed so Parliament has now taken control over Brexit. Wednesday should be interesting. 1 million marched (allegedly) how many was it that voted to leave ?
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sarahcount
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Post by sarahcount on Mar 25, 2019 23:42:07 GMT
Too late now..Letwin's motion just passed so Parliament has now taken control over Brexit. Wednesday should be interesting. 1 million marched (allegedly) how many was it that voted to leave ? 17.4 million voted to leave. (as we keep being told) But 16.1 million voted to remain (despite all the negatives we've been fed about the EU.) And this was three years ago. With lots of lies claims about a Brexit Dividend paying for new hospitals etc. There does seem to be a shift in the public perception now - even if the main parties are slow to pick this up. Look at the numbers who have made the effort to travel to London to march. Interesting times.
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Post by captainconfident on Mar 26, 2019 11:41:57 GMT
If I wasn't involved in the export of goods, and have quite a lot of investments and general standard of living that would suffer, I'd be interested to go through the WTO Brexit crash out just to see who is right about all this.
I guess the odds are 10/1 that we don't suddenly leave the EU without a safety net, but then we will hear forever more from the free-trade zealots about the sunny uplands that we missed out on.
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Post by mrclondon on Mar 26, 2019 11:56:39 GMT
captainconfident - correct the genie can't be put back in the bottle. This people vs parliament argument will run for a generation, the loser will be the UK economy, as its not sensible to invest in the UK without a settled agreement as to long term trade policy (as the two options are fundamentally incompatible). By long term I mean 30 years plus - it takes 5 years to build manufacturing capacity which then has a typical book life of 25 years.
What ever happens now, it is impossible to go back to the pre-2015 GE assumptions of the UK's place in Europe & the world.
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Post by mrclondon on Mar 26, 2019 12:20:28 GMT
Two things I've picked up from a worried well connected lib dem that bare some thought - his observation that a sizable minority on Saturday's march were not speaking English amongst themselves, coupled with some research that was discussed on Radio 5 on Sunday that the revoke petition signatories are predominately from known remain areas of the country, particularly London. (And hence continue to reflect the split nature of the UK geographically - this has relevance in any early GE)
Said lib dem, a true EU fanatic believes that a straight leave vs remain referendum will produce the same result unless it is rigged ( my choice of word, his was sanitised) by including EU citizens resident in the UK. This apparently is where the next battleground will be, along with reducing the voting age to 16.
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cb25
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Post by cb25 on Mar 26, 2019 12:52:58 GMT
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Mar 26, 2019 13:58:36 GMT
Two things I've picked up from a worried well connected lib dem that bare some thought - his observation that a sizable minority on Saturday's march were not speaking English amongst themselves, coupled with some research that was discussed on Radio 5 on Sunday that the revoke petition signatories are predominately from known remain areas of the country, particularly London. (And hence continue to reflect the split nature of the UK geographically - this has relevance in any early GE)
Said lib dem, a true EU fanatic believes that a straight leave vs remain referendum will produce the same result unless it is rigged ( my choice of word, his was sanitised) by including EU citizens resident in the UK. This apparently is where the next battleground will be, along with reducing the voting age to 16. Polls (of UK citizens) show a consistent and clear Remain majority now for quite some time. Given the conspicuous absence of any attempt to find a consensus for most voters in an almost 50/50 split electorate (i.e. a soft Brexit), and in the event of an outcome that is clearly only for Leave voters (i.e. a hard Brexit or no deal Brexit) it would be both political folly and antidemocratic in my view not to get ratification of May's deal or no deal by referendum. (As an aside, many EU citizens have already or are in the process of taking up UK citizenship since referendum). Re rigging the vote: personally, I consider it was a fix last time to exclude those who have the most to lose in any Leave/Remain decision (UK citizens using FOM to live abroad, EU citizens who are long term UK residents, and 16/17 year olds - who were old enough to decide on Scottish but not UK constitutional issues!). The changes to voter registration procedures haven't helped either.
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Post by bracknellboy on Mar 26, 2019 13:58:42 GMT
Two things I've picked up from a worried well connected lib dem that bare some thought - his observation that a sizable minority on Saturday's march were not speaking English amongst themselves, coupled with some research that was discussed on Radio 5 on Sunday that the revoke petition signatories are predominately from known remain areas of the country, Surprised that so many Scots travelled down when they could have held their own March in Edinburgh ... :-)
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Post by bracknellboy on Mar 26, 2019 16:51:12 GMT
when did Michael Fabricant steal BoJo's hair piece ?
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