benaj
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Post by benaj on Dec 22, 2020 17:48:02 GMT
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Post by stevepn on Dec 22, 2020 17:49:31 GMT
Precisely, a lot of the country has been on lockdown an on furlough since March and it still hasn't achieved anything. It has achieved a lot. We would be in an even worse mess without the restrictions. We would be a LOT better off if the knuckle-draggers and conspiracy theorists stopped thinking they knew best. In what way would we be a LOT better off if the knuckle-draggers and conspiracy theorists stopped thinking they knew best? I seem to remember a certain Professor Neil Ferguson committing adultery while the country was in lockdown. Also a certain Robert Jenrick who visited his parents during lockdown. Ferguson obviously doesn't believe what he preaches but he wants everyone else to believe it and suffer lockdown.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Dec 22, 2020 17:59:57 GMT
I seem to remember a certain Professor Neil Ferguson committing adultery while the country was in lockdown. Also a certain Robert Jenrick who visited his parents during lockdown. Ferguson obviously doesn't believe what he preaches but he wants everyone else to believe it and suffer lockdown.
A couple of good illustrations of exactly what I meant, yes. (Once we get past the shallow tabloidesque prurience)Yes, Ferguson visited his partner locally during lockdown... Which, actually, would now be legal under "support bubbles" in all but tier 4. He took an informed view of the circumstances, including the fact that he had already recovered from Covid, so was almost certainly immune. Then he immediately resigned when it was brought to light. Yes, Jenrick visited his parents and then his wife on the opposite side of the country during lockdown. Despite the fact that he was incredibly high risk, since this was at the time cabinet ministers were dropping like flies - including Johnson. He did the selfish thing, and then did not resign. Now, care to take a guess as to which of those two I would happily include in my sweeping generalisation, and which I would not? For a third illustration, we could always consider Cummings and his eye-test jaunts while actively suffering symptoms, if it isn't clear enough yet. Or Ferrier's train trip. Or... <insert long list of similar michael-extractors>
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Dec 22, 2020 18:09:49 GMT
I seem to remember a certain Professor Neil Ferguson committing adultery while the country was in lockdown. Also a certain Robert Jenrick who visited his parents during lockdown. Ferguson obviously doesn't believe what he preaches but he wants everyone else to believe it and suffer lockdown.
A couple of good illustrations of exactly what I meant, yes. (Once we get past the shallow tabloidesque prurience)Yes, Ferguson visited his partner locally during lockdown... Which, actually, would now be legal under "support bubbles" in all but tier 4. He took an informed view of the circumstances, including the fact that he had already recovered from Covid, so was almost certainly immune. Then he immediately resigned when it was brought to light. Yes, Jenrick visited his parents and then his wife on the opposite side of the country during lockdown. Despite the fact that he was incredibly high risk, since this was at the time cabinet ministers were dropping like flies - including Johnson. He did the selfish thing, and then did not resign. Now, care to take a guess as to which of those two I would happily include in my sweeping generalisation, and which I would not? For a third illustration, we could always consider Cummings and his eye-test jaunts while actively suffering symptoms, if it isn't clear enough yet. Or Ferrier's train trip. Or... <insert long list of similar michael-extractors> You seem to have forgotten that is was subsequently appointed a member of a similar advisory group. He has also I believe kept his position at Imperial the whole time. Left of centre evidence: www.spectator.co.uk/article/neil-ferguson-s-mysterious-membership-of-nervtagRight of centre evidence: www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/12/21/professor-lockdown-makes-return-advise-new-coronavirus-wave/In my view his adulterous behaviour and his covid hypocrisy are as nothing to do the damage he's caused via his advice to the gov.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Dec 22, 2020 18:14:38 GMT
Good. A trivial error of judgement has been deemed less relevant than his scientific experience and expertise.
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james100
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Post by james100 on Dec 22, 2020 18:16:35 GMT
It has achieved a lot. We would be in an even worse mess without the restrictions. We would be a LOT better off if the knuckle-draggers and conspiracy theorists stopped thinking they knew best. In what way would we be a LOT better off if the knuckle-draggers and conspiracy theorists stopped thinking they knew best? I seem to remember a certain Professor Neil Ferguson committing adultery while the country was in lockdown. Also a certain Robert Jenrick who visited his parents during lockdown. Ferguson obviously doesn't believe what he preaches but he wants everyone else to believe it and suffer lockdown.
Consenting adults with open / separated marriages. Hardly adultery in any negative sense, surely. He did something a bit silly but low-risk, paid for it (too high a price IMHO) and I'm happy to see him & his expertise back. Amazed he's bothering to contribute anything any more tbh given the way he was attacked in the press which was absolutely disgraceful.
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Post by stevepn on Dec 22, 2020 22:58:35 GMT
Good. A trivial error of judgement has been deemed less relevant than his scientific experience and expertise. Neil Ferguson was behind the research that sparked the mass culling of eleven million sheep and cattle during the 2001 outbreak of foot-and-mouth disease. He also predicted that up to 150,000 people could die. There were fewer than 200 deaths. . . In 2002, Ferguson predicted that up to 50,000 people would likely die from exposure to BSE (mad cow disease) in beef. In the U.K., there were only 177 deaths from BSE. In 2005, Ferguson predicted that up to 150 million people could be killed from bird flu. In the end, only 282 people died worldwide from the disease between 2003 and 2009. In 2009, a government estimate, based on Ferguson’s advice, said a “reasonable worst-case scenario” was that the swine flu would lead to 65,000 British deaths. In the end, swine flu killed 457 people in the U.K. I don't know about Ferguson's experience but his expertise is non existent.
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mrk
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Post by mrk on Dec 22, 2020 23:58:22 GMT
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Dec 23, 2020 0:59:21 GMT
Good. A trivial error of judgement has been deemed less relevant than his scientific experience and expertise. Neil Ferguson was behind the research that sparked the mass culling of eleven million sheep and cattle during the 2001 outbreak of foot-and-mouth disease. He also predicted that up to 150,000 people could die. There were fewer than 200 deaths. . . In 2002, Ferguson predicted that up to 50,000 people would likely die from exposure to BSE (mad cow disease) in beef. In the U.K., there were only 177 deaths from BSE. In 2005, Ferguson predicted that up to 150 million people could be killed from bird flu. In the end, only 282 people died worldwide from the disease between 2003 and 2009. In 2009, a government estimate, based on Ferguson’s advice, said a “reasonable worst-case scenario” was that the swine flu would lead to 65,000 British deaths. In the end, swine flu killed 457 people in the U.K. I don't know about Ferguson's experience but his expertise is non existent. What? Foot and mouth disease rarely affects humans - no one died in the 2001 outbreak.
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Dec 23, 2020 4:47:32 GMT
Good. A trivial error of judgement has been deemed less relevant than his scientific experience and expertise. Neil Ferguson was behind the research that sparked the mass culling of eleven million sheep and cattle during the 2001 outbreak of foot-and-mouth disease. He also predicted that up to 150,000 people could die. There were fewer than 200 deaths. . . In 2002, Ferguson predicted that up to 50,000 people would likely die from exposure to BSE (mad cow disease) in beef. In the U.K., there were only 177 deaths from BSE. In 2005, Ferguson predicted that up to 150 million people could be killed from bird flu. In the end, only 282 people died worldwide from the disease between 2003 and 2009. In 2009, a government estimate, based on Ferguson’s advice, said a “reasonable worst-case scenario” was that the swine flu would lead to 65,000 British deaths. In the end, swine flu killed 457 people in the U.K. I don't know about Ferguson's experience but his expertise is non existent. Post like this just annoy me, and I don't have the energy to "argue" every one I come across on the internet .
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Post by bracknellboy on Dec 23, 2020 7:17:15 GMT
Neil Ferguson was behind the research that sparked the mass culling of eleven million sheep and cattle during the 2001 outbreak of foot-and-mouth disease. He also predicted that up to 150,000 people could die. There were fewer than 200 deaths. . . In 2002, Ferguson predicted that up to 50,000 people would likely die from exposure to BSE (mad cow disease) in beef. In the U.K., there were only 177 deaths from BSE. In 2005, Ferguson predicted that up to 150 million people could be killed from bird flu. In the end, only 282 people died worldwide from the disease between 2003 and 2009. In 2009, a government estimate, based on Ferguson’s advice, said a “reasonable worst-case scenario” was that the swine flu would lead to 65,000 British deaths. In the end, swine flu killed 457 people in the U.K. I don't know about Ferguson's experience but his expertise is non existent. Post like this just annoy me, and I don't have the energy to "argue" every one I come across on the internet . Sometimes better not to: theferret.scot/fact-check-neil-ferguson-covid-19-predictions/i particularly like the BSE/50,000 claim. It appears that the Imperial models (NF paper via the link below) had the 95% confidence level at 50 (yes fifty) to 50,000 range. pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11786878/Which tells yoiu about all you need to know about the confidence they had in the understanding of transmission of BSE to humans and its manifestation as vCJD. Given the actual number is region of 178, it fell into that range (not terribly surprising). Of course, the actions taken to cull stopped the potential transmission chain, so we'll simply never know what it might have otherwise been.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Dec 23, 2020 7:35:29 GMT
Precisely, a lot of the country has been on lockdown an on furlough since March and it still hasn't achieved anything. It has achieved a lot. We would be in an even worse mess without the restrictions. We would be a LOT better off if the knuckle-draggers and conspiracy theorists stopped thinking they knew best. I think my point's being rather eloquently proven, don't you?
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james100
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Post by james100 on Dec 23, 2020 8:28:26 GMT
Good. A trivial error of judgement has been deemed less relevant than his scientific experience and expertise. Neil Ferguson was behind the research that sparked the mass culling of eleven million sheep and cattle during the 2001 outbreak of foot-and-mouth disease. He also predicted that up to 150,000 people could die. There were fewer than 200 deaths. . . In 2002, Ferguson predicted that up to 50,000 people would likely die from exposure to BSE (mad cow disease) in beef. In the U.K., there were only 177 deaths from BSE. In 2005, Ferguson predicted that up to 150 million people could be killed from bird flu. In the end, only 282 people died worldwide from the disease between 2003 and 2009. In 2009, a government estimate, based on Ferguson’s advice, said a “reasonable worst-case scenario” was that the swine flu would lead to 65,000 British deaths. In the end, swine flu killed 457 people in the U.K. I don't know about Ferguson's experience but his expertise is non existent. Looks like Neil Ferguson isn't the only one caught out "massaging the staats"
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Dec 23, 2020 8:41:41 GMT
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Post by dan1 on Dec 23, 2020 11:08:13 GMT
Just a random thought and I've done no research, anyways....
Thinking about these poor lorry drivers who need to pass a negative test to get over/under The Channel to get home for Christmas. And likewise, other situations in which a negative test is required as a "pass" so to speak. Are they self-swabbing? Because surely the temptation is to "fake it" (I don't know how but swab your sweat or some other liquid) in case you get stuck in Dover (no disrespect to Dover) for a couple of weeks.
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