Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Dec 23, 2020 17:01:07 GMT
Plenty of blame all round, yes. But I expect our government to be able to feed them! Can they not drive back into the UK to find whatever they need? I assume they have money, Credit Cards etc. Or once there can't they leave (genuine question)? You might think some enterprising food wagons would have moved in, like the ones you see in laybys frequented by lorries. I suppose our government could send in army caterers, like the army Nightingale hospitals.
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Dec 23, 2020 17:25:47 GMT
Just read a director of a British company importing stuff from Poland was contacted by a driver's wife to ask if he can get a loaf of bread to the stuck driver. The word "outrage" gets used a lot but that I really am right now. I also wonder about sleep. Ok, the trucks have beds but what about those travelling in vans - where are they going to sleep? And frankly how are "big" bodily needs going to take place? I'm not medic but I imagine these conditions would be very hard to tolerate. Regardless of whether you're a Leaver or Remainer the fault may lie at several doors but one is without doubt the UK government. Its moving into a humanitarian disaster. In the recent past, the government's response has often been to chuck money at the private sector to mop up. Well who is going to mop up here? It requires national leadership and resolution by our emergency and probably armed forces. Does no one think maybe the French are to blame for stranding their nationals and other EU nationals in the UK at Christmas? Yes I agree with that but didn't want to polarise into leave/remain and so was focusing on a narrower point which is we really should have prepared a lot better for this sort of thing. If you have thousands of people, some approaching retirement, without proper food, water or sanitation for several days, I suggest it is likely/possible at least one might die that wouldn't have done otherwise. On one level France owes us nothing but our government does need to ensure populations within its borders are safe. I assume much the French are enjoying this which is why Macron did it but that debate is probably best held within the brexit thread.
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Post by bracknellboy on Dec 23, 2020 17:33:53 GMT
You've missed the point, again. Never mind.
Bit of a hint: the observation is not about the "wrongs" of people giving freely of their own time and resources to feed and water people in need, nor indeed travelling x miles across whatever patchwork of counties and tier whatever's to do it.
You can condescend as much as you like with your other people miss your point repetitions. I didn’t miss your point; that you think charities shouldn’t have to step in where governments appear to be incompetent. That’s one opinion to have and it’s relatively innocuous. What took me aback was your snidey remark that the charitable volunteers had crossed from tier 3 to tier 4. I don’t know if that was your intent but it came across very badly to me. Hence I commented on that. If you didn’t want your main point to be distracted from don’t make “snidey” “small” comments on the end that don’t relate to your main point. Clearly you think of yourself as a “higher and more righteous” poster than others. So we’ll have to leave it at that with each to their own view. May I suggest that the "snidey comment" was to suggest I was pointing a finger at people who have gone out of their way to help, filling a gap left by institutional failure, and that perhaps I should consider reporting them ? [and I might add to the living embodiment of Cruella de Vil at that]
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Dec 23, 2020 17:39:49 GMT
Just read a director of a British company importing stuff from Poland was contacted by a driver's wife to ask if he can get a loaf of bread to the stuck driver. The word "outrage" gets used a lot but that I really am right now. I also wonder about sleep. Ok, the trucks have beds but what about those travelling in vans - where are they going to sleep? And frankly how are "big" bodily needs going to take place? I'm not medic but I imagine these conditions would be very hard to tolerate. Regardless of whether you're a Leaver or Remainer the fault may lie at several doors but one is without doubt the UK government. Its moving into a humanitarian disaster. In the recent past, the government's response has often been to chuck money at the private sector to mop up. Well who is going to mop up here? It requires national leadership and resolution by our emergency and probably armed forces. Does no one think maybe the French are to blame for stranding their nationals and other EU nationals in the UK at Christmas? Umm, no. Not a bit of it. Temporary block on ALL movement across the water while they figure out what the chuff is going on with the new variant that our own goverment states is "out of control"? Seems sensible public health measure. That virus variant doesn't check passports before deciding who to infect, does it?
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Dec 23, 2020 18:03:43 GMT
Does no one think maybe the French are to blame for stranding their nationals and other EU nationals in the UK at Christmas? Umm, no. Not a bit of it. Temporary block on ALL movement across the water while they figure out what the chuff is going on with the new variant that our own goverment states is "out of control"? Seems sensible public health measure. That virus variant doesn't check passports before deciding who to infect, does it? The new variant is already in parts of the EU. They could have let drivers get back to France get tested and then self isolate if necessary, it wasn't essential to trap them in the UK. Edit: Long distance lorry drivers have very limited contact with people, they spend most of their time in their cabs, deliver their loads and with the current restrictions do not enter premises.
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star dust
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Post by star dust on Dec 23, 2020 18:15:12 GMT
Season's Greetings to everyone on the Forum. I can only hope that as good a time as possible is had by all, and that 2021 proves to be better for all of us ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png)
Also at this time it's traditional to offer Goodwill to all, so this is especially for Deees and bracknellboy, and others getting hot under the collar recently - please spread some peace, and I do hope you all have a chilled Xmas ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png)
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Dec 23, 2020 18:27:44 GMT
Umm, no. Not a bit of it. Temporary block on ALL movement across the water while they figure out what the chuff is going on with the new variant that our own goverment states is "out of control"? Seems sensible public health measure. That virus variant doesn't check passports before deciding who to infect, does it? The new variant is already in parts of the EU. They could have let drivers get back to France get tested and then self isolate if necessary, it wasn't essential to trap them in the UK. Edit: Long distance lorry drivers have very limited contact with people, they spend most of their time in their cabs, deliver their loads and with the current restrictions do not enter premises. Yes and they are keyworkers to boot. So less likely than most sections of the population to infect, likely to drive through France without stopping and incredibly important for our lives. Would Adrian feel comfortable telling a Polish trucker stuck for days over Christmas that what he is doing is necessary for public health? I suggest not and therefore one should keep consistency with what one writes from behind a keyboard.
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Post by bracknellboy on Dec 23, 2020 18:58:18 GMT
how many tiers we go to do you think ? Could they be turned up all the way to 11 ?
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james100
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Post by james100 on Dec 23, 2020 19:28:29 GMT
how many tiers we go to do you think ? Could they be turned up all the way to 11 ? Sure. I'm leapfrogging 2 to 4 this week and not even at the national average for positive cases.
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Dec 23, 2020 19:41:52 GMT
how many tiers we go to do you think ? Could they be turned up all the way to 11 ? We currently have Medium risk, high risk, very high risk and extremely high risk. I'm not certain there is much scope for any more tiers.
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09dolphin
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Post by 09dolphin on Dec 23, 2020 19:58:07 GMT
how many tiers we go to do you think ? Could they be turned up all the way to 11 ? We currently have Medium risk, high risk, very high risk and extremely high risk. I'm not certain there is much scope for any more tiers. How about probable death, death and certain death as tiers 5 - 7 Merry Christmas and hope for a better 2021 to everyone
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Dec 23, 2020 20:03:47 GMT
Slide 6 says 5,052 "health impact events" (defined as "unable to perform normal daily activities, unable to work, required care from doctor or health care professional") from 215,362 vaccinations. I make that 1 in 42, rather than 35 - minor - but is that a list of "serious" reactions?Is "felt a bit woozy, had to be helped to a bed for a quick lie-down" counted as "required care from health care professional"? Six cases of anaphylaxis from 215k vaccinations - the NHS reported a couple in the first day, both in people who were so prone to it they carried epipens. The wording is so vague as to be meaningless. Were they unable to perform normal daily activities because they dropped dead just after the vaccination, or did they just have a bit of a sore arm.
Overall a bit of a damp squib, certainly not going to dissuade me from getting jabbed.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Dec 23, 2020 20:06:10 GMT
We currently have Medium risk, high risk, very high risk and extremely high risk. I'm not certain there is much scope for any more tiers. How about probable death, death and certain death as tiers 5 - 7 Entire world's tier 7, then. Life: A sexually transmitted disease with a 100% mortality rate.
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mrk
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Post by mrk on Dec 24, 2020 13:14:59 GMT
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benaj
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Post by benaj on Dec 24, 2020 14:38:42 GMT
The new variant is spreading faster and yet the gov has not gone full throttle to suppress it.
Can the public really adapt so quickly to adapt changes from tiers to tiers? The news is so depressing and who really wants to find out the latest tiers?
Can we really get back to alert level three before Easter? I am not so sure.
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