cb25
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Post by cb25 on Aug 28, 2020 9:28:48 GMT
More importantly perhaps - discount rates seem to be dropping ( see post by bradley02 ), so those who wish to exit quicker will be slightly better off. Better off by minus 8.2% at present. I think I'll keep taking the peanuts for now. I meant better off relative to the minus 10%+ a seller would have to have accepted a few days back, but I take your point.
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Post by bradley02 on Aug 28, 2020 10:23:36 GMT
More importantly perhaps - discount rates seem to be dropping ( see post by bradley02 ), so those who wish to exit quicker will be slightly better off. Better off by minus 8.2% at present. I think I'll keep taking the peanuts for now. I can only see buy/sell discounts reducing over the coming months. Following the opening of the SM pressure value to enable an exit at a discount, rates soon dropped from 13/15% to 6.5/7.5%. AC's email that seemed to be misinterpreted raised rates to 11/13% now back down to 7.5/8.5% ish. The markets is only a few weeks young and needs to settle. There are many investors happy to buy discounted units and possibly many more waiting for interest payments to have the funds to do so. I intend on continuing to buy up discounted units at 8%+ for the limited time of availability and hold them for the long term. That said, I hope no investor panics into selling at the current levels if you do not need to. Sit on your hands, receive your interest payments, and watch the discounted rates reduce over the next few months (Only my opinion )
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blender
Member of DD Central
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Post by blender on Aug 28, 2020 10:25:20 GMT
Yes, it's all relative. Now rather worse off compared with the 6% before AC spooked the horses on Tuesday with an 'important update' (or 'don't panic!') email, which apparently (my interpretation) was nothing much to worry about and mainly sent for reasons of regulatory compliance. There is an old proverb which states that a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. The question we must answer individually, is a bird in the cash account worth more or less than 1.08 (approx.) birds in the QAA?
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Post by bradley02 on Aug 28, 2020 10:59:05 GMT
Yes, it's all relative. Now rather worse off compared with the 6% before AC spooked the horses on Tuesday with an 'important update' (or 'don't panic!') email, which apparently (my interpretation) was nothing much to worry about and mainly sent for reasons of regulatory compliance. There is an old proverb which states that a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. The question we must answer individually, is a bird in the cash account worth more or less than 1.08 (approx.) birds in the QAA? This is key in my opinion of overreaction and fear causing large sell discounts on the SM. from Stuart's post a few days ago. Quote 'It is interesting to see the market implied expectation on discounts as being around 10% temporarily today as that suggests people are expecting £22m of Access Account losses on top of both the existing provision fund cash and also on top of future PF contributions' End of quote. At a 5% discount it implies an expectation of around £11m+ losses for the AAs starting at £0 today.
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ian
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Post by ian on Aug 28, 2020 11:14:58 GMT
Yes, it's all relative. Now rather worse off compared with the 6% before AC spooked the horses on Tuesday with an 'important update' (or 'don't panic!') email, which apparently (my interpretation) was nothing much to worry about and mainly sent for reasons of regulatory compliance. There is an old proverb which states that a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. The question we must answer individually, is a bird in the cash account worth more or less than 1.08 (approx.) birds in the QAA? This is key in my opinion of overreaction and fear causing large sell discounts on the SM. from Stuart's post a few days ago. Quote 'It is interesting to see the market implied expectation on discounts as being around 10% temporarily today as that suggests people are expecting £22m of Access Account losses on top of both the existing provision fund cash and also on top of future PF contributions' End of quote. At a 5% discount it implies an expectation of around £11m+ losses for the AAs starting at £0 today. There is also the opportunity cost of remaining in at a paltry 4% with liquidity & capital redemption issues. Can get in excess of 15% with a 12month lock on with possibly safer investments
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Post by bradley02 on Aug 28, 2020 12:19:24 GMT
This is key in my opinion of overreaction and fear causing large sell discounts on the SM. from Stuart's post a few days ago. Quote 'It is interesting to see the market implied expectation on discounts as being around 10% temporarily today as that suggests people are expecting £22m of Access Account losses on top of both the existing provision fund cash and also on top of future PF contributions' End of quote. At a 5% discount it implies an expectation of around £11m+ losses for the AAs starting at £0 today. There is also the opportunity cost of remaining in at a paltry 4% with liquidity & capital redemption issues. Can get in excess of 15% with a 12month lock on with possibly safer investments 15% return . 12 month . Safer. Good luck with that. I have to ask, who is that with?? I promise I will not push in the queue.
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dead-money
Rocket to the Moon
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Post by dead-money on Aug 28, 2020 14:06:24 GMT
There is also the opportunity cost of remaining in at a paltry 4% with liquidity & capital redemption issues. Can get in excess of 15% with a 12month lock on with possibly safer investments 15% return . 12 month . Safer. Good luck with that. I have to ask, who is that with?? I promise I will not push in the queue. "possibly safer" BridgeCrowd perchance ?
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SteveT
Member of DD Central
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Post by SteveT on Aug 28, 2020 14:10:42 GMT
15% return . 12 month . Safer. Good luck with that. I have to ask, who is that with?? I promise I will not push in the queue. "possibly safer" BridgeCrowd perchance ? No, typical BridgeCrowd rates are 7-9% (before defaults), and that's with a minimum £5000 per loan
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ian
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Post by ian on Aug 28, 2020 14:52:31 GMT
There is also the opportunity cost of remaining in at a paltry 4% with liquidity & capital redemption issues. Can get in excess of 15% with a 12month lock on with possibly safer investments 15% return . 12 month . Safer. Good luck with that. I have to ask, who is that with?? I promise I will not push in the queue. There are property funds; large privately owned business valued at circa £1b net asset value £160m presently sole debt are loan notes with debenture over the company LT net asset value circa 37% 40% maximum allowed. Latest offer 15% for 12 months £10/25k min investment. Been with them for a number of years sometimes a couple of moths late on redeeming but you get 1.5% per month. Their developments are largely pre sold to institutions like invesco. They are and always were safer than assetz IMHO; that said I only ever really used assetz as a bank account with 25% of my capital available each week.
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Post by stuartassetzcapital on Aug 28, 2020 16:23:00 GMT
Sounds like the High Street Group.
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alibaba
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Post by alibaba on Aug 28, 2020 16:32:53 GMT
In the interest of balance.
With regard to the previous post, I would like to add my experience of AC :-
25k in GBBA1 19k in one loan DM (the 20% fiasco). 15 suspended loans
40k in GBBA2. 25 suspended loans
7k in GEA. 5k in one loan, 20% again. 7 suspended loans
6k MLA
95k in QAA, I have been in queue to withdraw since March 15th
10k accrued interest
No personal response from AC just the usual can down the road, they obviously expect investors like myself who have been here from the early days to fade away whilst they boast about how great their business model is.
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ian
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Post by ian on Aug 28, 2020 16:53:11 GMT
Sounds like the High Street Group. Sounds like Stuart knows much better places to invest in than his own company also.😀👍 As I said AC offered a really good alternative to a bank account until it lost the plot & lost sight of its need to serve the needs of its primary stakeholders - its lenders.
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ian
Posts: 342
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Post by ian on Aug 28, 2020 17:07:50 GMT
In the interest of balance. With regard to the previous post, I would like to add my experience of AC :- 25k in GBBA1 19k in one loan DM (the 20% fiasco). 15 suspended loans 40k in GBBA2. 25 suspended loans 7k in GEA. 5k in one loan, 20% again. 7 suspended loans 6k MLA 95k in QAA, I have been in queue to withdraw since March 15th 10k accrued interest No personal response from AC just the usual can down the road, they obviously expect investors like myself who have been here from the early days to fade away whilst they boast about how great their business model is. The DM is a complete fiasco. Whilst there may be no financial misfeasance, it smacks of an old boys network being in play. How investors are expected to take AC serious when the next update on this ‘default’ loan is in approx 12 months time! One also seriously has to question the quality of AC management & their professional advisors (valuers) when recovery from defaults in even the simplest of loans like #330 is less than 50% of detailed market value.
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Post by stuartassetzcapital on Aug 28, 2020 17:52:34 GMT
Sounds like the High Street Group. Sounds like Stuart knows much better places to invest in than his own company also.😀👍 As I said AC offered a really good alternative to a bank account until it lost the plot & lost sight of its need to serve the needs of its primary stakeholders - its lenders. I said I knew them, I never said I endorsed them ! DYOR as I give no opinion. And we have, from 2013, always be very clear that a sustainable business doesn’t just serve one stakeholder group but instead we, unusually, balance the needs and rewards of all stakeholders in order to create a sustainable business - something the investment world would do well to emulate in my opinionated view. Fairer growth for all. We’d like to be here, serving lenders, borrowers, shareholders and colleagues in 2100.
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alender
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Post by alender on Aug 28, 2020 18:14:58 GMT
Sounds like Stuart knows much better places to invest in than his own company also.😀👍 As I said AC offered a really good alternative to a bank account until it lost the plot & lost sight of its need to serve the needs of its primary stakeholders - its lenders. I said I knew them, I never said I endorsed them ! DYOR as I give no opinion. And we have, from 2013, always be very clear that a sustainable business doesn’t just serve one stakeholder group but instead we, unusually, balance the needs and rewards of all stakeholders in order to create a sustainable business - something the investment world would do well to emulate in my opinionated view. Fairer growth for all. We’d like to be here, serving lenders, borrowers, shareholders and colleagues in 2100. Where was the balance when AC decided to to give flat rate repayments In AAs leaving the larger lenders with a more toxic set of loans which might/will (who knows from the info given out so far) be untradable.
In the interest of balance please can you tell me which of your accounts have been a success for lenders. I have made a list but there may have been more.
MLA GBA1 GBA2 GEA
QAA 30D 90D
I understand some people have made money from trading or getting out before the problems come to light but I would like to know how you view you success for lenders who have stuck with you (and are now stuck) pre and post covid.
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