blender
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Post by blender on Jan 21, 2021 13:20:09 GMT
To lose the lot a large amount of real estate would have to be made worthless. Not going to happen. To lose access to the lot - yes, for some time, but I agree AC have taken the right course. You are of course entirely correct, but when fear takes over you start considering extreme scenarios. The same fear is what drove people to liquidate their shares at any price and cause a 30% drop in the stock market. In hindsight the risk of losing it all was very low, but at the time things were a bit hectic and it seemed very real to me 10 months ago. Yes, you are correct. I was not scared of losing it all but was scared of having no access to cash. I could not sell here and so I sold elsewhere at a loss. It caught me at the wrong time, having too much invested for bonuses in April. We learn, for a while.
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cb25
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Post by cb25 on Jan 21, 2021 13:50:17 GMT
so that was through leaving the queue and rejoining it at a discount? So the main queue is not moving but if selling at small discount, it is? Yes if you leave the main queue and set up a withdrawal at a discount. In my experience, over the last couple of days 0.7% is instant, 0.6% has been selling fairly quickly and 0.5% is not moving. This will of course change. Agree with that. I sold £5K at 0.6% discount this morning, took just under 3 hours
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ashtondav
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Post by ashtondav on Jan 22, 2021 10:33:44 GMT
Ok, decided to test the market and placed a withdrawal of £10k at 0.5%. Will I get a nibble...
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ian
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Post by ian on Jan 22, 2021 13:27:41 GMT
0.5% will be broken next week it will be interesting if when we’re operating @ say 0.2% will AC only allow withdrawal from the QAA and allow full access
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ptr120
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Post by ptr120 on Jan 22, 2021 16:33:35 GMT
My money was put in the queue for withdrawal at par many months ago - as you say, there was no penalty to do so. By the time I get to the front of the queue it is very likely that I'll actually want the money out, but I suspect that many (perhaps half?) don't actually want their money out just now, but just joined the queue to get a place in line. Perhaps we'll see a promotion like in the old days of an extra 0.25% PA for cancelling a withdraw request, and going back in to the 30 / 90 day access account?
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Post by Badly Drawn Stickman on Jan 22, 2021 17:11:52 GMT
My money was put in the queue for withdrawal at par many months ago - as you say, there was no penalty to do so. By the time I get to the front of the queue it is very likely that I'll actually want the money out, but I suspect that many (perhaps half?) don't actually want their money out just now, but just joined the queue to get a place in line. Perhaps we'll see a promotion like in the old days of an extra 0.25% PA for cancelling a withdraw request, and going back in to the 30 / 90 day access account? Logically being in the queue is the only smart option, even if you want to keep the money in. Simply reinvesting at a discount increases returns overall even at low percentages. Complete no brainer surely. I would suggest that is the bulk of the market currently.
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alender
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Post by alender on Jan 22, 2021 19:19:57 GMT
My money was put in the queue for withdrawal at par many months ago - as you say, there was no penalty to do so. By the time I get to the front of the queue it is very likely that I'll actually want the money out, but I suspect that many (perhaps half?) don't actually want their money out just now, but just joined the queue to get a place in line. Perhaps we'll see a promotion like in the old days of an extra 0.25% PA for cancelling a withdraw request, and going back in to the 30 / 90 day access account? Logically being in the queue is the only smart option, even if you want to keep the money in. Simply reinvesting at a discount increases returns overall even at low percentages. Complete no brainer surely. I would suggest that is the bulk of the market currently. This what I was saying would be the effect when AC started talking about the SM, I was told numerous times on this forum I was wrong, interestingly by a number of the people who are now doing exactly what I predicted. As I said if you wish to remain with AC the only logical course of action is to request withdrawals and buy back in SM, wash, rinse and repeat.
The aim of AC should be to restore access to the Access Accounts, after all that is what it says on the tin, but instead they do the complete opposite. The access accounts have only 2 sources of funds for access, new money buying into the accounts and capital repayments. All new money has been stopped by the introduction of the SM, most of the capital repayments are being kept by AC in the accounts (probably for new lending) therefore severely restricting access.
Perhaps one day access will be retuned, this will be because of low interest rates, the closure of other platforms like Growth Street, closure of accounts at Rate Setter etc but not by the actions of AC.
AC should not penalise those in the withdrawal queue by using AA funds to subsidies those who wish to stay, after all this is what we signed up to when we invested with reasonable expectation of access with no mention of penalties for withdrawals. This is far removed from a welcome bonus for new money entering the accounts. As the SM discounts are below 1% how about a 1% bonus for new money and paying out the capital repayments to investors who request withdrawals, after all it is their money. Access would soon be restored, AC could take this bonus out of the commission they earn on new loans once lending is resumed.
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Post by oppsididitagain on Jan 22, 2021 20:02:29 GMT
My money was put in the queue for withdrawal at par many months ago - as you say, there was no penalty to do so. By the time I get to the front of the queue it is very likely that I'll actually want the money out, but I suspect that many (perhaps half?) don't actually want their money out just now, but just joined the queue to get a place in line. Perhaps we'll see a promotion like in the old days of an extra 0.25% PA for cancelling a withdraw request, and going back in to the 30 / 90 day access account? Logically being in the queue is the only smart option, even if you want to keep the money in. Simply reinvesting at a discount increases returns overall even at low percentages. Complete no brainer surely. I would suggest that is the bulk of the market currently. Yep, this is what I've been doing VI. I managed to recycle approx 30K from my AA into my 30AA and made about 2.5-4% on the spread + the .25% up tick moving it over to the 30AA. Unfortunately in the week AC have stopped investments into the 30AA if you have a pending withdrawal. Up until now you could invest in 30AA, trigger the notice period but still invest into the account. The SHM moves around quite a bit , today I managed to invest 10K at 1% and also withdraw some money at 0.6% (only 1.5k so far). Currently its 0.7/.09% in 5K.
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Post by jonrgrant on Jan 23, 2021 3:57:48 GMT
My money was put in the queue for withdrawal at par many months ago - as you say, there was no penalty to do so. By the time I get to the front of the queue it is very likely that I'll actually want the money out, but I suspect that many (perhaps half?) don't actually want their money out just now, but just joined the queue to get a place in line. Perhaps we'll see a promotion like in the old days of an extra 0.25% PA for cancelling a withdraw request, and going back in to the 30 / 90 day access account? From my perspective I placed 30k for liquidation at PAR on 6th Jan 2020 from the 90day. My plan being then to transfer 20k into AC isa on 7th April and withdraw 10k for my SIPP. to-date I have received at PAR £5657 of the 30k over 13/10 months (excluding 90 days / with 90 days). Obviously this has been withdrawn and from my perspective every future penny I get will be withdrawn and will never be returned in AC as a future ISA or other investment. As AC preferred to override the normal queuing process in preference to a gazumping option for those who wished to jump the queue at loss / AA value depreciation. Also all of my other AC investments which I was also going to sell and transfer to the AC isa over the next few years are now for sale at PAR and will be removed as and when repaid. Fortunately I managed to liquidate funds from other sources and allocated these to a S&S isa for this tax year. The treatment of Lenders by AC, LW, Wellesley etc means the P2P sector is an area I can never trust or believe in again, T&C mean nothing and just get re-written to justify any changes made.
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Post by brightspark on Jan 23, 2021 8:14:16 GMT
Whilst understanding and empathising with your viewpoint it is a fact that the financial affairs of many people throughout the entire world have been thrown into disarray by the Covid pandemic. Against that background is it not your own position that you have had to make some financial adjustments to accommodate this upheaval and viewed in that light you appear to be emerging relatively unscathed?
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alender
Member of DD Central
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Post by alender on Jan 23, 2021 9:43:02 GMT
Whilst understanding and empathising with your viewpoint it is a fact that the financial affairs of many people throughout the entire world have been thrown into disarray by the Covid pandemic. Against that background is it not your own position that you have had to make some financial adjustments to accommodate this upheaval and viewed in that light you appear to be emerging relatively unscathed? It is true that "financial affairs of many people throughout the entire world have been thrown into disarray" but now is also it is also true that quite a few investments have normalised. In ACs case they have not done a single thing to normalise the AAs which will occur if/when access is returned, in fact their actions have exacerbated the issue.
AC
- Introduced flat rate of repayments which disadvantaged large investors, this caused a lot a of bad feeling (and lack of funds) making AC a place where large investors are second class and are clearly not welcome. There can be no better way if you wish to reduce funds/increase withdrawals than to isolate and disadvantage you largest investors.
- Rigged a vote on forbearance where any one who did not vote was deemed to have voted for ACs preferred option, no matter what the outcome of the vote handling a vote in this way will lose confidence in AC and with more people determined to get out.
Also the consent changing of the ways the accounts operate with no consultation or regard for the lenders except perhaps a rigged vote, these accounts are nothing like I signed up for. This can only further reduce confidence and therefore reluctance to stay or increase funds in the accounts.
It would be nice if AC could do something positive to increase access to the AAs or even just stop making the situation worse.
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ian
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Post by ian on Jan 23, 2021 10:58:44 GMT
I suspect AC are going to have to rethink the withdrawal process in order to reset the access accounts. I would imagine the only way they can do this is for with withdrawals from the 90 day and 30 day account to initially transfer to the QAA, with transfers the cash account being Queued. If I was doing this I would do it in conjunction with removal of the lender fee and an increase in interest rate on the 30/90 day accounts in order incentivise investors to retain funds in the term accounts.
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Post by jonrgrant on Jan 23, 2021 14:11:26 GMT
Whilst understanding and empathising with your viewpoint it is a fact that the financial affairs of many people throughout the entire world have been thrown into disarray by the Covid pandemic. Against that background is it not your own position that you have had to make some financial adjustments to accommodate this upheaval and viewed in that light you appear to be emerging relatively unscathed? I would agree that my investment portfolio across shares, P2P, commodities, property and bank accounts, was designed to spread sector risk and hopefully deliver growth in some areas and income in others. I also note that I never viewed any P2P as a bank account that gave quick access to cash so these funds were viewed as long term. My sell request early Jan 2020, was prior to COVID 19 being classed as a Pandemic and was NOT due to panic selling or the need to access long term investments quickly, note for quick access I have always kept 6 months of funds in my bank account. However due to the action of AC and those who panic sold or pushed in front of the cueing, due to needing money from long term investments as they thought that P2P was an easy access bank account (did not understand or did not allocate funds for quick access). I have ended up losing potential investment growth as only now have I managed to fully fund this years ISA allowance, which I normally fund at the start of the tax year, not near the end. Also regarding being unscathed from P2P in general. I have losses every week from LW, still awaiting something hopefully from Collateral, awaiting administration on MT returns, only getting 1% of capital return on investment in Wellesley, awaiting the sale of property results from BP who claim a loss even though property is at premium level. So not having liquidated losses in AC still means overall the management of P2P in general have failed to protect investors and have moved from making their money from well managed loans to the easy access lenders accounts by changing T&C,s to suite lenders money extraction. BM, RS and FC hopefully will break even or possible slight interest although less than what they advertised. Only two P2P I currently have any business management respect for now being ABL and KL.
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Post by Harland Kearney on Jan 24, 2021 0:35:16 GMT
Money is now leaving Assetz capital which is being repaid to me instead of being reinvested.
Once again, never fail to amaze me!
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johni
Member of DD Central
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Post by johni on Jan 24, 2021 10:16:30 GMT
Whilst understanding and empathising with your viewpoint it is a fact that the financial affairs of many people throughout the entire world have been thrown into disarray by the Covid pandemic. Against that background is it not your own position that you have had to make some financial adjustments to accommodate this upheaval and viewed in that light you appear to be emerging relatively unscathed? It is true that "financial affairs of many people throughout the entire world have been thrown into disarray" but now is also it is also true that quite a few investments have normalised. In ACs case they have not done a single thing to normalise the AAs which will occur if/when access is returned, in fact their actions have exacerbated the issue.
AC
- Introduced flat rate of repayments which disadvantaged large investors, this caused a lot a of bad feeling (and lack of funds) making AC a place where large investors are second class and are clearly not welcome. There can be no better way if you wish to reduce funds/increase withdrawals than to isolate and disadvantage you largest investors.
- Rigged a vote on forbearance where any one who did not vote was deemed to have voted for ACs preferred option, no matter what the outcome of the vote handling a vote in this way will lose confidence in AC and with more people determined to get out.
Also the consent changing of the ways the accounts operate with no consultation or regard for the lenders except perhaps a rigged vote, these accounts are nothing like I signed up for. This can only further reduce confidence and therefore reluctance to stay or increase funds in the accounts.
It would be nice if AC could do something positive to increase access to the AAs or even just stop making the situation worse.
Wrong on block new money entering the accounts any new money entered but via a discount. This happened and is still happening. But you now have your wish AC have stopped recycling money meaning you will get out a lot slower. As people who get cash back now have to withdraw rather than reinvesting. Meaning the queues were reducing faster as those who wanted out left those that didn't but wanted reduced risk to stay put money back into accounts.
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