Mikeme
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Post by Mikeme on Apr 12, 2021 15:50:22 GMT
Feel free to wave it as much as you want.
I just believe that if you have a serious amount of skin in the game you look at things differently.
Also a tad annoying for someone who jumped ship at the start (along with others) caused the crisis to criticise those who have since been lock in and are not happy with how AC are changing rules and in general handling the situation.
Your comments stink of rich and privileged, sod the little guy who is just trying to get by my much money is more important. As I said a year ago I think the decision to ration the payouts by person rather than holder value was correct. I think he was referring to me in as much as I did get out of the QAA but before the payout was finally made I wasn't complaining.
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ian
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Post by ian on Apr 12, 2021 16:58:23 GMT
Some people seem intent on being first to trigger the next potential crisis by logging a “zillion” complaints to the FOS for a blunder that was corrected before even the biggest swinging lenders were only disadvantaged a few £s. It was a colossal blunder. It was right to put immense pressure on AC. AC compounded the colossal blunder by not correcting it the instant it was highlighted. AC did correct it before there was anything other than a few £s disadvantage materialised. Continuing to seek an FOS “jackpot payout” is just vengeful, IMHO. One with low probability of big compensation payout but a concerning tail risk if it materialises Your right it was a huge blunder that should have been, but never was rectified; although the decision was reversed - possibly immediately after the threat of legal action from a group on here from memory. The blunder though was the final straw for many. Irrespective of how much you’ve invested we all want AC to prosper and for nobody to lose Money. That said all businesses want bigger investing / spending customers. AC have consistently disenfranchised larger investors, without those investors it is likely the company will increasingly need more expensive tier 1 financing which is to the detriment of all.
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alender
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Post by alender on Apr 12, 2021 20:05:09 GMT
Feel free to wave it as much as you want.
I just believe that if you have a serious amount of skin in the game you look at things differently.
Also a tad annoying for someone who jumped ship at the start (along with others) caused the crisis to criticise those who have since been lock in and are not happy with how AC are changing rules and in general handling the situation.
Your comments stink of rich and privileged, sod the little guy who is just trying to get by my much money is more important. As I said a year ago I think the decision to ration the payouts by person rather than holder value was correct. Yep, rich and privileged.
Everything I got I worked hard for.
Started with nothing, parents from Shoreditch and Stepney, brought up in a rough part of London. First job paper round at 13, and not stopped work since, went on to work in a butchers mostly cleaning out the chiller and freezer at or below freezing point while at school which was regarded as one of the worst comprehensives in the country. Many people I knew from school ended up in prison. Then office cleaning through college years. Had my own green grocery business for a few years, used to start at 3am and often finish after 7pm, out in all weathers. Worked in the city for number of years long hours, stressfully work, 3 hours commute each day. Now doing hands on development on my own property, including ground work, brick laying, plastering and labouring. Hand loaded and unloaded about 900 bricks in the last 2 days on my own.
Perhaps you can tell my partner she has a really easily life as well, she is a care home manger and hands on carer. We are so privileged we may even get a couple of hours one or two evenings a week and a half day at the weekend together without work
If you fancy a day of privileged come and spend a day working with me labouring on a building site in mud, or perhaps with my partner in a care home or even moving boxes round my friends green grocers business from 6am to 7 pm as I did with mine.
PS Because of the cash flow problems AC caused me last year I was unable to employ much labour so I had to pick up this work myself, In the last year I was being asked by some of the guys (usually with families to support) who laboured for me before for work as they have none but I had limited cash. Hopefully this year I can give them some work and push on the project. There are always consequences which go beyond the immediate affected parties for actions like the ones taken by AC.
One of the thing I have learnt coming from an East End family if anyone takes something from you that is yours you fight for it tooth and nail, even if you don't win you make sure there is consequences otherwise it will just keep happening.
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iRobot
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Post by iRobot on Apr 12, 2021 20:58:45 GMT
<snip> PS Because of the cash flow problems AC caused me last year I was unable to employ much labour so I had to pick up this work myself, In the last year I was being asked by some of the guys (usually with families to support) who laboured for me before for work as they have none but I had limited cash. Hopefully this year I can give them some work and push on the project. There are always consequences which go beyond the immediate affected parties for actions like the ones taken by AC.
Be sure to mention that in your claims for compo when discussing with AC / FOS / FCA / ASA. In fact, have the labourers put their own complaints in for loss of earnings! Although, if previous engagements were <ahem> a strictly cash transaction, they may not wish to be quite so vocal  
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alender
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Post by alender on Apr 12, 2021 21:06:14 GMT
<snip> PS Because of the cash flow problems AC caused me last year I was unable to employ much labour so I had to pick up this work myself, In the last year I was being asked by some of the guys (usually with families to support) who laboured for me before for work as they have none but I had limited cash. Hopefully this year I can give them some work and push on the project. There are always consequences which go beyond the immediate affected parties for actions like the ones taken by AC.
Be sure to mention that in your claims for compo when discussing with AC / FOS / FCA / ASA. In fact, have the labourers put their own complaints in for loss of earnings! Although, if previous engagements were <ahem> a strictly cash transaction, they may not wish to be quite so vocal I can assure you if these guys think someone has done them wrong it is not the FOS / FCA they turn to.
But the point is there are people in less than privileged positions being affected by ACs actions while the directors keep taking their very nice salaries.
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Post by Badly Drawn Stickman on Apr 12, 2021 21:13:47 GMT
Your comments stink of rich and privileged, sod the little guy who is just trying to get by my much money is more important. As I said a year ago I think the decision to ration the payouts by person rather than holder value was correct. Yep, rich and privileged.
Everything I got I worked hard for.
Started with nothing, parents from Shoreditch and Stepney, brought up in a rough part of London. First job paper round at 13, and not stopped work since, went on to work in a butchers mostly cleaning out the chiller and freezer at or below freezing point while at school which was regarded as one of the worst comprehensives in the country. Many people I knew from school ended up in prison. Then office cleaning through college years. Had my own green grocery business for a few years, used to start at 3am and often finish after 7pm, out in all weathers. Worked in the city for number of years long hours, stressfully work, 3 hours commute each day. Now doing hands on development on my own property, including ground work, brick laying, plastering and labouring. Hand loaded and unloaded about 900 bricks in the last 2 days on my own.
Perhaps you can tell my partner she has a really easily life as well, she is a care home manger and hands on carer. We are so privileged we may even get a couple of hours one or two evenings a week and a half day at the weekend together without work
If you fancy a day of privileged come and spend a day working with me labouring on a building site in mud, or perhaps with my partner in a care home or even moving boxes round my friends green grocers business from 6am to 7 pm as I did with mine.
PS Because of the cash flow problems AC caused me last year I was unable to employ much labour so I had to pick up this work myself, In the last year I was being asked by some of the guys (usually with families to support) who laboured for me before for work as they have none but I had limited cash. Hopefully this year I can give them some work and push on the project. There are always consequences which go beyond the immediate affected parties for actions like the ones taken by AC.
One of the thing I have learnt coming from an East End family if anyone takes something from you that is yours you fight for it tooth and nail, even if you don't win you make sure there is consequences otherwise it will just keep happening.
Beyond doubt the 'yarns' would rival those in a kilt factory. However the ultimate conclusion has to be that you should have had money you 'needed so badly' in a 'safe' investment not P2P.
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alender
Member of DD Central
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Post by alender on Apr 12, 2021 21:18:30 GMT
Yep, rich and privileged.
Everything I got I worked hard for.
Started with nothing, parents from Shoreditch and Stepney, brought up in a rough part of London. First job paper round at 13, and not stopped work since, went on to work in a butchers mostly cleaning out the chiller and freezer at or below freezing point while at school which was regarded as one of the worst comprehensives in the country. Many people I knew from school ended up in prison. Then office cleaning through college years. Had my own green grocery business for a few years, used to start at 3am and often finish after 7pm, out in all weathers. Worked in the city for number of years long hours, stressfully work, 3 hours commute each day. Now doing hands on development on my own property, including ground work, brick laying, plastering and labouring. Hand loaded and unloaded about 900 bricks in the last 2 days on my own.
Perhaps you can tell my partner she has a really easily life as well, she is a care home manger and hands on carer. We are so privileged we may even get a couple of hours one or two evenings a week and a half day at the weekend together without work
If you fancy a day of privileged come and spend a day working with me labouring on a building site in mud, or perhaps with my partner in a care home or even moving boxes round my friends green grocers business from 6am to 7 pm as I did with mine.
PS Because of the cash flow problems AC caused me last year I was unable to employ much labour so I had to pick up this work myself, In the last year I was being asked by some of the guys (usually with families to support) who laboured for me before for work as they have none but I had limited cash. Hopefully this year I can give them some work and push on the project. There are always consequences which go beyond the immediate affected parties for actions like the ones taken by AC.
One of the thing I have learnt coming from an East End family if anyone takes something from you that is yours you fight for it tooth and nail, even if you don't win you make sure there is consequences otherwise it will just keep happening.
Beyond doubt the 'yarns' would rival those in a kilt factory. However the ultimate conclusion has to be that you should have had money you 'needed so badly' in a 'safe' investment not P2P. Your right, I thought AC was relatively safe, if things got bad the repayments would be returned to me giving me some cash flow not held onto by AC. I made one big mistake I trusted AC to do the right thing.
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ian
Posts: 342
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Post by ian on Apr 13, 2021 6:06:21 GMT
Beyond doubt the 'yarns' would rival those in a kilt factory. However the ultimate conclusion has to be that you should have had money you 'needed so badly' in a 'safe' investment not P2P. Your right, I thought AC was relatively safe, if things got bad the repayments would be returned to me giving me some cash flow not held onto by AC. I made one big mistake I trusted AC to do the right thing. That said many preempted such issues by forsaking a higher return and electing for the QAA or in my case the 30 day account with staged weekly payments. This evidently was seen as gaming the system when AC applied an unprecedented ‘one for you’ distribution. Good news is with last nights payout we’re nearly out.
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ian
Posts: 342
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Post by ian on Apr 13, 2021 6:37:04 GMT
Well, thanks for Iansplaining that. I feel I've learned something today. Just correcting inaccurate observations of other members of the forum. One who believed AC was profitable the other who likened investment in the AA to investing in the stock market.
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Apr 13, 2021 7:37:57 GMT
Well, thanks for Iansplaining that. I feel I've learned something today. Just correcting inaccurate observations of other members of the forum. One who believed AC was profitable the other who likened investment in the AA to investing in the stock market. Actually neither said either. One merely noted that profit in the previous year offset the last two years, no comment on lifetime profitability. The other was referring to liquidity which requires a buyer for a seller and is true in the stock market as in P2P. Invest in an illiquid share and you wont get your money back. Illiquiity does not equate to Ponzi.
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iRobot
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Post by iRobot on Apr 13, 2021 8:19:21 GMT
Just correcting inaccurate observations of other members of the forum. One who believed AC was profitable the other who likened investment in the AA to investing in the stock market. Actually neither said either. One merely noted that profit in the previous year offset the last two years, no comment on lifetime profitability. The other was referring to liquidity which requires a buyer for a seller and is true in the stock market as in P2P. Invest in an illiquid share and you wont get your money back. Illiquiity does not equate to Ponzi. Similarly reported profitability (or lack thereof) is not necessarily an indicator of ongoing viability; Amazon being a prime example. Pun definitely intended given their investment of profits operating surpluses from eCommerce activities back into the business when a) expanding that eCommerce capacity / capability and b) developing additional revenue streams such as AWS and Prime. An approachable outline of Amazon's business activities up to 2014 can be found here with a couple of follow up articles referenced at the bottom.
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alanh
Posts: 556
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Post by alanh on Apr 13, 2021 8:21:20 GMT
Just correcting inaccurate observations of other members of the forum. One who believed AC was profitable the other who likened investment in the AA to investing in the stock market. Actually neither said either. One merely noted that profit in the previous year offset the last two years, no comment on lifetime profitability. The other was referring to liquidity which requires a buyer for a seller and is true in the stock market as in P2P. Invest in an illiquid share and you wont get your money back. Illiquiity does not equate to Ponzi. So the last time they made a profit was 3 years ago and they have losses for the past 2 years that we have any information for? i.e. things are getting worse. What about the last year? Their loan book and hence income has shrunk dramatically so I dread to think what the next set of numbers show (despite all the extra fees slapped on lenders accounts). The introduction of exit accounts looks like a last gasp effort to try and stop the shrinkage by locking lenders into a permanently reinvested account but this could backfire on them big time as it forces people to make a decision between getting out while they can or maybe getting out at some point in the future, if that is possible at the time. As everyone invested in these as "access" accounts I would think there is going to be little appetite to stay invested with AC forever, with all the associated risks that brings. Oh but don't worry - everyone one from Ratesetter is coming over. Please. Having received all their money back from a successfully wound down platform I can't see many RS lenders wanting to get involved in this complete mess.
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blender
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Post by blender on Apr 13, 2021 8:27:21 GMT
Well, thanks for Iansplaining that. I feel I've learned something today. Just correcting inaccurate observations of other members of the forum. One who believed AC was profitable the other who likened investment in the AA to investing in the stock market. And this is 'correcting' your own defamatory and false assertions which I think just malicious and putting our forum at risk: <quote snipped>' A self-justification worthy of Donald Trump, and just nonsense on stilts. How kind of you to stay on this thread just to correct others.
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ian
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Post by ian on Apr 13, 2021 9:51:30 GMT
Actually neither said either. One merely noted that profit in the previous year offset the last two years, no comment on lifetime profitability. The other was referring to liquidity which requires a buyer for a seller and is true in the stock market as in P2P. Invest in an illiquid share and you wont get your money back. Illiquiity does not equate to Ponzi. Similarly reported profitability (or lack thereof) is not necessarily an indicator of ongoing viability; Amazon being a prime example. Pun definitely intended given their investment of profits operating surpluses from eCommerce activities back into the business when a) expanding that eCommerce capacity / capability and b) developing additional revenue streams such as AWS and Prime. An approachable outline of Amazon's business activities up to 2014 can be found here with a couple of follow up articles referenced at the bottom. The comparison to Amazon esq companies is slightly misleading as they have accessed signify amounts of public money. AC have accessed some seed capital which is more or less identical amount has been spent on directors salaries. Private equity has yet to bite at the opportunity. The company has lost. Circa £1.7m in the past 2 years £700k in the past 3 years and lost over £5.5m in total. The past 12 months are said to be profitable- we will see. Much may depend on treatment of contingent liabilities. ACs business model is entirely dependent upon loan capital and has defaulted on redemption of a large chunk of that loan capital over the past 13 months. When faced with the issues AC faces as regards investor confidence It probably would have been preferable to have secured additional tier 1 capital and induced investors in with better rates, rather than adding penalties for capital redemption & the complexity of whatever the exit accounts are. CBILs has doubtless come to the assistance of both the loan book & the company. The full financial impact of the pandemic however will ultimately be seen over the course of the next 18 months
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mogish
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Post by mogish on Apr 13, 2021 10:55:57 GMT
So overall is the opinion that future investment in AC is good or a bad idea?
I have been recycling my QAA into 30day.
Is this a sensible move or is there something I've missed?
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