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Post by bracknellboy on Nov 18, 2023 18:25:30 GMT
Bit mystified by this one: Drink-driver filmed himself slurring 'I'm smashed' before killing womanGets 6 years for killing a young adult while driving p*****d. In a transit van. After several people had told him to leave his van at the pub. And his mobile record showed a call where he he admitted he was "smashed" in a video he made while driving. Six years ? He was done for causing Death by Dangerous driving. The sentencing guidlines suggest he was treated as a B for culpability. And then given mid range rather than top end. I struggle to understand why it has not been treated as level A. I'm sure that will come down to difference between 'impaired' and 'highly impaired', but my understanding is that clip level is at 1.5 times. And not helpfully, the judge has used the term 'significantly impaired', which from a sentencing point of view seems to be a 'not recognised' definition. Regardless, out in 3 years for killing someone when knowingly incapable of safely driving a large vehicle ? Hopefully the CPS will challenge the sentence as too lenient. |
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keitha
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Post by keitha on Nov 18, 2023 20:08:26 GMT
Me too feels very lenient
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travolta
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Post by travolta on Nov 18, 2023 20:10:24 GMT
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Nov 18, 2023 20:47:01 GMT
Drink driving is sheer luck whether you don't crash, crash without hurting anyone or crash and hurt or kill someone. The sentence should be greater for any drink/drug driving no matter what the outcome. But yes killing someone should be treated as murder.
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Nov 18, 2023 21:38:49 GMT
I find it very difficult to equate or almost equate the person that drinks too much, drives and has an "accident" with the person that sets out to murder someone in cold blood.
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keitha
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Post by keitha on Nov 18, 2023 23:04:51 GMT
perhaps court take the view "he was normally sensible, but drink took that sense away"
It seems to be common these days Man stabs someone "it was the drink what did it" man beats up partner "I'd had a drink and my old problem came back"
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Nov 18, 2023 23:27:57 GMT
perhaps court take the view "he was normally sensible, but drink took that sense away" It seems to be common these days Man stabs someone "it was the drink what did it" man beats up partner "I'd had a drink and my old problem came back" So beat up wife equals drink driving ? Come on!
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Post by bracknellboy on Nov 19, 2023 8:26:25 GMT
I find it very difficult to equate or almost equate the person that drinks too much, drives and has an "accident" with the person that sets out to murder someone in cold blood. One doesn't need to equate them though to believe the sentence(s) should be more reflective of the severity of outcome and level of culpability.
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Post by bracknellboy on Nov 19, 2023 8:53:17 GMT
Drink driving is sheer luck whether you don't crash, crash without hurting anyone or crash and hurt or kill someone. The sentence should be greater for any drink/drug driving no matter what the outcome. But yes killing someone should be treated as murder. It couldn't be treated as murder. But sentences should reflect the severity of the outcome and the culpability for it.
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Mousey
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Post by Mousey on Nov 19, 2023 9:22:22 GMT
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Nov 19, 2023 9:57:06 GMT
Most surprising thing for me is that he was only 1.5-2x the limit.
Read the culpability list in those sentencing guidelines, you can see exactly why it was B not A.
That means the starting point is 6yrs, with a range of 4-9 - but he pleaded guilty early, so got 1/4 off - which means the sentence given was very near the top of B, 8yrs less 2yrs = 6yrs.
The 9yr ban also follows the sentencing guidelines - minimum 5yr plus half of the prison sentence. And, because it's dangerous driving, he'll have to take an extended driving test to regain his licence after the expiry of that ban.
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Post by bracknellboy on Nov 19, 2023 10:11:35 GMT
Yes, given he has pleaded guilty then if it is categorised as B then it would be in line. I had missed that he had pleaded guilty (or perhaps more honestly had simply overlooked that aspect when it comes to sentencing). I'm still thinking though that it ought to have at least been borderline as to whether it was B or A. Given that he had disregarded the warnings of others not to drive (but is that 'persistently disregarded' ?), he had used his mobile to make a video call (but was that 'prolonged' use ?), and he very very clearly knew he was in no state to drive ("I'm smashed"). If just feels that those things taken in aggregate rather than separately ought to count to raise the level of culpability. But apparently not.
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Post by bernythedolt on Nov 19, 2023 13:35:32 GMT
Most surprising thing for me is that he was only 1.5-2x the limit. [...] Yes, I questioned that when reported as "one-and-a-half to two times over the legal drink-drive limit". That introduces ambiguity. Does "over" here mean he was 1.5 to 2 times the limit, or that much beyond the limit (so he was 2.5 to 3 times the limit)?
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james100
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Post by james100 on Nov 19, 2023 14:44:34 GMT
[quote author=" adrianc" <snip>And, because it's dangerous driving, he'll have to take an extended driving test to regain his licence after the expiry of that ban.[/quote] Unbelievable to me that he hasn't been banned for life given he's willfully endangered life by driving smashed, resulting in actual loss of life. |
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benaj
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Post by benaj on Nov 19, 2023 14:55:00 GMT
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