michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Jun 15, 2024 15:49:39 GMT
Not sure how they can justify this nonsense as impartial reporting. I didn't get passed Kunsberg's opening and bolded paragraph which quotes someone unknown. What does Nigel Farage really want?(i.e. What does the government/bbc want us to think about him) www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2jj95dgegno |
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ilmoro
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Post by ilmoro on Jun 15, 2024 16:45:56 GMT
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Post by bracknellboy on Jun 15, 2024 17:10:17 GMT
Not sure how they can justify this nonsense as impartial reporting. I didn't get passed Kunsberg's opening and bolded paragraph which quotes someone unknown. What does Nigel Farage really want?(i.e. What does the government/bbc want us to think about him) www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2jj95dgegnoWell that means you read about 1/20th or less of the article. So no wonder you don't know how it can be justified as you haven't actually read it. Which frankly is probably a shame: its a moderately interesting and certainly reasonable piece, even if it doesn't really saying anything seismically new. The opening para you refer to is hardly the first time that sentiment has been expressed about Farage. The quoting of unnamed but close to the subject sources is a very long standing tradition in politics: its certainly been happening for as long as I was old enough to read and understand news. If you only used quotes that were attributable, you wouldn't be a very useful, well informed or trusted political correspondent.
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keitha
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Post by keitha on Jun 15, 2024 17:26:47 GMT
Not sure how they can justify this nonsense as impartial reporting. I didn't get passed Kunsberg's opening and bolded paragraph which quotes someone unknown. What does Nigel Farage really want?(i.e. What does the government/bbc want us to think about him) www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2jj95dgegnoWell that means you read about 1/20th or less of the article. So no wonder you don't know how it can be justified as you haven't actually read it. Which frankly is probably a shame: its a moderately interesting and certainly reasonable piece, even if it doesn't really saying anything seismically new. The opening para you refer to is hardly the first time that sentiment has been expressed about Farage. And in case you hadn't noticed, the quoting of unnamed but close to the subject sources is a very long standing tradition in politics. If you only only used quotes that were attributable, you wouldn't be a very useful, well informed or trusted political correspondent. Having read it, Macron in France springs to mind, a new party a cult around the leader, and basically won the first parliamentary / presidential election on keep the right out. ditto to an extent Zelensky in the Ukraine. Many on here would be wise to consider that in much of the world our Conservative part would be considered centralist, indeed I know Democrats from the US who consider it Socialist. so those that think the Conservatives are far right are wrong in world terms. it is our left that is very left wing particularly groups like momentum, and I wouldn't be surprised to see a momentum led coup within the labour party after the election
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Jun 15, 2024 18:42:47 GMT
Well that means you read about 1/20th or less of the article. So no wonder you don't know how it can be justified as you haven't actually read it. Which frankly is probably a shame: its a moderately interesting and certainly reasonable piece, even if it doesn't really saying anything seismically new. The opening para you refer to is hardly the first time that sentiment has been expressed about Farage. And in case you hadn't noticed, the quoting of unnamed but close to the subject sources is a very long standing tradition in politics. If you only only used quotes that were attributable, you wouldn't be a very useful, well informed or trusted political correspondent. Having read it, Macron in France springs to mind, a new party a cult around the leader, and basically won the first parliamentary / presidential election on keep the right out. ditto to an extent Zelensky in the Ukraine. Many on here would be wise to consider that in much of the world our Conservative part would be considered centralist, indeed I know Democrats from the US who consider it Socialist. so those that think the Conservatives are far right are wrong in world terms. it is our left that is very left wing particularly groups like momentum, and I wouldn't be surprised to see a momentum led coup within the labour party after the election Not really, Macron was winning a personality contest, then creating a party to win on their aura. Farage will be creating a cult of personality, then the party burning up in the corona. But yes, Starmers political life expectancy is about 3 years
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keitha
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Post by keitha on Jun 15, 2024 22:21:15 GMT
I see a coup in the next 2-3 months led by momentum and the unions, and I see the possibility of Abbott or Corbyn being installed as leader
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Jun 15, 2024 22:50:29 GMT
I see a coup in the next 2-3 months led by momentum and the unions, and I see the possibility of Abbott or Corbyn being installed as leader Quoted for posterity  . Corbyn as a potential leader terrifies me (which is why I didn't vote for Labour when he headed the party). Abbott as leader isn't going to happen. Partly because she's a woman, yes. Partly because she's black. Yes. But mainly, massively mainly, because she's just not very good(*). They'll be no coup in the UK. Not in my lifetime anyway. And I am happy for anybody to "quote me for posterity" . * She does deserve massive respect for being the first black woman in Parliament. She's served for decades. She's been re-elected for decades. She must have faced horrific. I paused when I typed this to consider my words. She must have faced horrific sexual and racist discrimination. For decades. And she held her head high. I don't agree with a lot of her policies but that woman deserves respect.
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Jun 16, 2024 4:01:41 GMT
I see a coup in the next 2-3 months led by momentum and the unions, and I see the possibility of Abbott or Corbyn being installed as leader It would be typical of the loony lefties to try such a stunt. They'd rather have Corby as leader in opposition than Starmer as PM.
I can't see too many Labour MP's wanting Corbyn back (I believe you need 20% of them to get the party leader removed), it would be like turkeys voting for Christmas.
But maybe this is all an evil lefty plan. As soon as Starmer gets elected he resigns and Corbyn gets voted in as leader and PM. After all before the last election Starmer did say that he thought Corbyn would make a good PM.
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Post by bracknellboy on Jun 16, 2024 5:57:35 GMT
I see a coup in the next 2-3 months led by momentum and the unions, and I see the possibility of Abbott or Corbyn being installed as leader Quoted for posterity . Corbyn as a potential leader terrifies me (which is why I didn't vote for Labour when he headed the party). Abbott as leader isn't going to happen. Partly because she's a woman, yes. Partly because she's black. Yes. But mainly, massively mainly, because she's just not very good(*). They'll be no coup in the UK. Not in my lifetime anyway. And I am happy for anybody to "quote me for posterity" . * She does deserve massive respect for being the first black woman in Parliament. She's served for decades. She's been re-elected for decades. She must have faced horrific. I paused when I typed this to consider my words. She must have faced horrific sexual and racist discrimination. For decades. And she held her head high. I don't agree with a lot of her policies but that woman deserves respect. Agreed. But it would be nice if she could count. And stop putting her foot in her mouth. But most of all a shame that she had tendencies to support the unsupportable. I used to quite like watching her and Michael Portillo on the Andrew Neil's show. whatever it was called.
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pikestaff
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Post by pikestaff on Jun 16, 2024 7:57:48 GMT
I see a coup in the next 2-3 months led by momentum and the unions, and I see the possibility of Abbott or Corbyn being installed as leader The likelihood of Keir Starmer being forcibly removed as leader is minimal, and the likelihood of his replacement being left wing is even smaller. The Labour Party Rulebook sets out how leadership elections work. Under Chapter 4, Clause II (2)(B)(ii) (Page 25): "Where there is no vacancy, nominations may be sought by potential challengers each year prior to the annual session of Party conference. In this case any nomination must be supported by 20 per cent of the Commons members of the PLP. Nominations not attaining this threshold shall be null and void. The sitting Leader or Deputy Leader shall not be required to seek nominations in the event of a challenge under this rule." In short: - The unions and party members don't get a say unless there is an election
- Any opponent must have the support of 20% of MPs in order to get on the ballot
- The sitting leader has the right to be on the ballot also.
There is only a small rump of left wing MPs left in parliament (far fewer than 20%) and there will be proportionally fewer still if Labour wins a large majority, because any Momentum types have been excluded from candidate selection. The larger the Labour majority the less power the left wing will have. So it ain't going to happen. The rules are slightly different if the leader resigns or falls under a bus. In this case nominations require the support of both 20% of MPs and either 5% of constituency labour parties or at least 3 affiliates (at least 2 of which must be trade unions) comprising at least 5% of affiliate membership. The requirement for 20% support by MPs is sufficient to keep any left winger off the ballot. Remember, Corbyn only got onto the ballot because some MPs misguidedly lent him their vote, never believing he could win link. That mistake won't be repeated.
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Post by bracknellboy on Jun 16, 2024 8:26:16 GMT
I see a coup in the next 2-3 months led by momentum and the unions, and I see the possibility of Abbott or Corbyn being installed as leader .... Remember, Corbyn only got onto the ballot because some MPs misguidedly lent him their vote, never believing he could win link. That mistake won't be repeated.If I recall, and I haven't looked at the link, Frank Field was one of those who decided to nominate/support the nomination of Corbyn because they felt there needed to be some spicing up/mixing up of the candidates. A decision that I suspect he regretted until he (sadly) passed away.
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Jun 16, 2024 8:42:41 GMT
My best mate lives in Corbyn's constituency. Apparently there are way more Corbyn support posters up in windows than Labour posters. This might reflect more ardent support on the part of Corbyn, or lack of enthusiasm for Labour, but the local support for him is real.
It will be interesting to see if he beats the Labour candidate.
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Post by bracknellboy on Jun 16, 2024 9:16:55 GMT
My best mate lives in Corbyn's constituency. Apparently there are way more Corbyn support posters up in windows than Labour posters. This might reflect more ardent support on the part of Corbyn, or lack of enthusiasm for Labour, but the local support for him is real. It will be interesting to see if he beats the Labour candidate. I may be mis remembering this, but I thought local polling was in fact putting him ahead ? Edit: Bookies have him at 4/9 odds on to win. Can't find anything about specific polling.
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ilmoro
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Post by ilmoro on Jun 16, 2024 9:56:36 GMT
My best mate lives in Corbyn's constituency. Apparently there are way more Corbyn support posters up in windows than Labour posters. This might reflect more ardent support on the part of Corbyn, or lack of enthusiasm for Labour, but the local support for him is real. It will be interesting to see if he beats the Labour candidate. I may be mis remembering this, but I thought local polling was in fact putting him ahead ? Edit: Bookies have him at 4/9 odds on to win. Can't find anything about specific polling. Electoral Calculus - generally to be viewed with caution as doesnt reflect local factors well but currently Kier's looking a bit Spursy there.  www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/fcgi-bin/calcwork23.py?seat=Islington%20North
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Jun 16, 2024 12:54:11 GMT
My best mate lives in Corbyn's constituency. Apparently there are way more Corbyn support posters up in windows than Labour posters. This might reflect more ardent support on the part of Corbyn, or lack of enthusiasm for Labour, but the local support for him is real. It will be interesting to see if he beats the Labour candidate. I may be mis remembering this, but I thought local polling was in fact putting him ahead ? Edit: Bookies have him at 4/9 odds on to win. Can't find anything about specific polling. It's easy to vote for Corbyn (or the Greens, who are now the neo-Corbynites) when you know Labour is going to win a thumping majority (due to the ridiculous electoral system). I wonder what it would be like if it were neck and neck?
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