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Post by cautious on Mar 7, 2015 14:14:33 GMT
Hi all,
Your thoughts please;
I have 5k maturing early April from Wellesley.
Not going to re-invest there as I felt 'uncomfortable' when they left the P2PFA.
Was going to dabble in Finding Circle but you lot put me off that idea with your thread posts.
So, I fancy asset backed.....which platforms should I consider ?
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bigfoot12
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Post by bigfoot12 on Mar 7, 2015 15:51:15 GMT
In general the asset backed are hard work as there is a lot to read about each loan. Of the true P2P, the leaders are probably Assetz and Thin Cats.
Thin Cats (TC) are £1,000 minimum per loan, so with £5,000 you would spread yourself across 5 loans, which might be too few. They do have a lot of choice at this moment in time 10-12 loans so you will easily be able to find 5 loans. They also have a lending club (TLC) which you can invest in and it will invest in several other loans (simple criteria, no due diligence). This might be worth a look if you wanted to try Thin Cats. One point of note is that TC are about to have a very major change in their software. I would suggest waiting until after Easter.
Assetz Capital (AC) have fewer offerings at the moment, though in all cases interest is earned from the moment the investment is made. They keep promising lots of loans, but there isn't as much as many would like. They also have a Green Energy fund which invests in wind turbines with a provision fund delivering 7% on money lent out. I don't use the Green fund but recent reports have only 90% lent out so you might want to test the water in stages. AC is currently my favourite platform so be aware that I am biased. There is no minimum investment in each loan.
Others might suggest some other platforms which I don't know about.
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spockie
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Post by spockie on Mar 7, 2015 15:52:04 GMT
Funding Secure, Saving Stream and Assetz Capital. They all work differently, so you will need to read up and make sure you are happy with what they offer and that you are clear on the risks.
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Post by oldnick on Mar 7, 2015 15:56:57 GMT
Hi all,
Your thoughts please;
I have 5k maturing early April from Wellesley.
Not going to re-invest there as I felt 'uncomfortable' when they left the P2PFA.
Was going to dabble in Finding Circle but you lot put me off that idea with your thread posts.
So, I fancy asset backed.....which platforms should I consider ? The silly answer is: all the asset backed platforms. However, if you've been reading the discussions on each of those boards, you may already have reached conclusions of your own about the relative merits of each of them. Perhaps as important as the platform itself is the type of security attached to individual loans. Not all securities are equal and neither are all borrowers. Is it better to have weak security on a loan that never defaults, or good security on a defaulting loan that drags on into administration for years? What should be made clear about this kind of investing is that there are no certainties other than that some loans will default. If it were possible to weed those loans out at the beginning we'd all be happier, but the returns would inevitably be reduced if there was no risk attached. Why not split your money between several platforms to see how they each perform for you?
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Post by ranjeb on Mar 7, 2015 18:46:58 GMT
I have to say I'm not experiencing the problems with FC that most seem to have it on here and I'm getting by far the best returns there out of five platforms I'm on.
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Post by meledor on Mar 7, 2015 20:39:29 GMT
If you are looking at asset backed it's worth considering Ablrate - mostly loans for aircraft leasing.
In general aircraft leasing has been quite lucrative for a number of years. With Ablrate the security is enhanced by the aircraft being ring-fenced in its own special purpose entity. The lending members lending to this entity through the Abrate platform have a first charge over the entire ownership shares of this entity which in turn is secured by the aircraft being owned by this entity. The entity then receives lease rentals from the airline/operator. Ablrate are currently inviting bids for an underwritten £2.475m loan (44 days left) at 11% for 3 years in respect of an ATR 42 on lease to a South American government owned airline.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Mar 7, 2015 21:33:06 GMT
I have to say I'm not experiencing the problems with FC that most seem to have it on here and I'm getting by far the best returns there out of five platforms I'm on. : May we ask which four platforms you're finding that FC is outperforming?
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mikes1531
Member of DD Central
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Post by mikes1531 on Mar 7, 2015 21:37:39 GMT
If you are looking at asset backed it's worth considering Ablrate - mostly loans for aircraft leasing.
With Ablrate the security is enhanced by the aircraft being ring-fenced in its own special purpose entity. The lending members lending to this entity through the Abrate platform have a first charge over the entire ownership shares of this entity which in turn is secured by the aircraft being owned by this entity.
What protection do Ablrate investors have against the aircraft flying off and not returning? That's not an issue with 'bricks & mortar' lending, or a platform like FS who physically take possession of the smaller items they're lending against.
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Post by ranjeb on Mar 7, 2015 22:05:55 GMT
I have to say I'm not experiencing the problems with FC that most seem to have it on here and I'm getting by far the best returns there out of five platforms I'm on. : May we ask which four platforms you're finding that FC is outperforming? Assetz, Wellesley, zopa and rTesetter. I appreciate they're different models but there you are.
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Post by meledor on Mar 7, 2015 22:20:35 GMT
If you are looking at asset backed it's worth considering Ablrate - mostly loans for aircraft leasing.
With Ablrate the security is enhanced by the aircraft being ring-fenced in its own special purpose entity. The lending members lending to this entity through the Abrate platform have a first charge over the entire ownership shares of this entity which in turn is secured by the aircraft being owned by this entity.
What protection do Ablrate investors have against the aircraft flying off and not returning? That's not an issue with 'bricks & mortar' lending, or a platform like FS who physically take possession of the smaller items they're lending against.
It is a requirement of the aircraft lease between the lessor (the borrower) and the lessee (the airline) that the lessee has adequate insurance to cover loss. The proceeds of the insurance claim payable to the lessor as owner will then be covered by the charge that the lending members have over the lessor.
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Post by ablrateandy on Mar 8, 2015 0:28:58 GMT
If you are looking at asset backed it's worth considering Ablrate - mostly loans for aircraft leasing.
With Ablrate the security is enhanced by the aircraft being ring-fenced in its own special purpose entity. The lending members lending to this entity through the Abrate platform have a first charge over the entire ownership shares of this entity which in turn is secured by the aircraft being owned by this entity.
What protection do Ablrate investors have against the aircraft flying off and not returning? That's not an issue with 'bricks & mortar' lending, or a platform like FS who physically take possession of the smaller items they're lending against. Our aircraft are largely used to move passengers around. When we lease out an aircraft, the lessee signs a deregistration certificate that we retain possession of. If they stop paying their lease then we present this certificate to the local aviation authority and that will prevent them from operating the aircraft in a commercial capacity. Even if they hid it in some obscure jungle (a) we are insured and (b) they can't get spares or use the aircraft at any airfield that is subject to any form of jurisdiction. We also take out mortgages over the aircraft in multiple jurisdictions so that they can't be moved cross-border. Our main sponsor has leased out around 400 aircraft in his career. He has had three cases where lease payments have ceased. In all three of those, the aircraft has been recovered, re-sprayed and re-leased to a new client within three months. Generally our clients are governments or large corporations who are loathe to default because if they do, they won't be able to lease aircraft off anyone else either. We are happy to chat in more detail on the subject if you drop us a line.
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Post by lynnanthony on Mar 8, 2015 4:22:12 GMT
ranjeb: May we ask which four platforms you're finding that FC is outperforming? Assetz, Wellesley, zopa and rTesetter. I appreciate they're different models but there you are. My experience is that both Assetz and Thincats have outperformed FC, taking charges and losses into account. And FC is just so time consuming. And most FC loans are not asset backed are they unless things have changed significantly since I stopped investing there?
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Post by jumpingjackflash on Mar 8, 2015 9:22:13 GMT
Depends on your risk appetite. I have a bit with Funding Circle which I have had good experiences with. I put some into Zopa which does what it says on the tin. I only lend through the P2PFA platforms and thus having a spare couple of grand I looked into Lending Works & Landbay. Both looked good although I ended up opting for Landbay as the type of lending it does seems the lowest risk. Obviously returns are lower than most of the others but so far so good.
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am
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Post by am on Mar 8, 2015 10:00:00 GMT
Assetz, Wellesley, zopa and rTesetter. I appreciate they're different models but there you are. My experience is that both Assetz and Thincats have outperformed FC, taking charges and losses into account. And FC is just so time consuming. And most FC loans are not asset backed are they unless things have changed significantly since I stopped investing there? My running yield with FC is greater than my gross yield with AC. If you strip out cashback (which is front loaded, and flatters the running yield) this reverses.
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Mar 8, 2015 13:13:12 GMT
My running yield with FC looks pretty good too, but it is flattered by cashback (now virtually extinct), recommend a friend bonuses, purchases in Oct/Nov 2014 when rates were exceptionally high, and part sales at a markup. Whether the extra over 5 year at RS is actually worth the time and effort it takes is debatable, but if you enjoy fiddling with it, it is probably cheaper than fiddling with stocks and shares.
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