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Post by mrclondon on Feb 17, 2014 13:51:46 GMT
Could it be the auction never actually started (at 15:00) and hence no emails were sent given the loan presumably filled to 100% at 14:55 ish with the pre-bids which were well over 100% when I looked late morning. My final pre-bid didn't make the cut so there must still have been more than 100% of pre-bids at 14:55. We've run some tests and have confirmed that this is the case. We could fix it so the usual notification is sent out, but that doesn't seem right. Do lenders think that a politely worded "ha ha ha you should have prebid" email saying that the auction has already been fulfilled would be more appropriate? Or do we leave it as is and do not send anything (not my preference)? Yes, a politely worded email advising the loan had been fulfilled from pre-bids would seem appropriate.
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mikeb
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Post by mikeb on Feb 17, 2014 18:16:17 GMT
chris: Thanks for looking to see what happened -- yes a "This auction started but was fulfilled by prebidding" would be useful, rather than a non-email situation.
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Post by jevans4949 on Feb 17, 2014 21:36:26 GMT
Since at the point of auction the loan amount was just over half the original amount, and the original bids which were downgraded to pre-bids were still, after cancellations, more than enough to cover the loan, this is hardly surprising. Once it was clear that the basis of the loan was going to change, Assetz should probably have cancelled the original auction and re-scheduled the revised proposition.
However , I'm not complaining as I was near the front of the queue and got what I wanted.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Feb 17, 2014 23:54:47 GMT
We've run some tests and have confirmed that this is the case. We could fix it so the usual notification is sent out, but that doesn't seem right. Do lenders think that a politely worded "ha ha ha you should have prebid" email saying that the auction has already been fulfilled would be more appropriate? Or do we leave it as is and do not send anything (not my preference)? Yes, a politely worded email advising the loan had been fulfilled from pre-bids would seem appropriate. In addition -- or possibly as an alternative -- to such an email, AC might consider sending emails to people who have asked to be notified of an auction's start before a situation such as this develops. For instance, when an auction's pre-bids reach some percentage of the proposed borrowing -- 70%? 80%? 90%? -- interested lenders would receive an email informing them of the pre-bid situation and suggesting that if they're still considering participating in the loan they might wish to place a pre-bid themselves. It ought to be possible to check the email addresses of those who might receive the email against the list of pre-bidders and remove the pre-bidders from the distribution list, though I can envision a situation where even those people might be interested in increasing their pre-bids if they knew they might not have a later opportunity to do so. In an effort not to complicate the main 'Lend' page, someone who clicks on the "To receive an email" button could be presented with options to choose to be notified when pre-bids reach a certain level -- possibly even settable by the user, but that's probably a bit OTT. I realise that because pre-bids can be withdrawn, and because not all pre-bids are funded, estimating the percentage filled in advance a loan is isn't an exact science. Perhaps as AC gain experience with pre-bids they may be able to predict reasonably accurately what proportion of pre-bids will become real bids by the time an auction goes live. It may be that the 'drop out' fraction is small enough that the issue can be ignored.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Feb 18, 2014 0:29:45 GMT
Further to the above suggestion, the issue may not be nearly as likely to recur in the future.
In re-looking at the LtL7 bid list in order to check whether the problem with the list had been corrected, I can see that in addition to the loan amount being resized significantly downward, there is another factor that will have aggravated the over-subscription situation -- this auction was set up before AC introduced the current maximum bid controls. As a result, one lender seems to have taken over 20% of this loan, and another I noticed has over 5%. There may be others as well. If the current policy had been in place at the beginning -- when the request was for a loan of £264k -- a limit of about £2.5k/lender would have been imposed. Even after the loan was resized to £95k, that still would have limited lenders to a 40th of the total loan and probably would have reduced the over-subscription factor considerably.
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andy2001
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Post by andy2001 on Feb 18, 2014 23:43:54 GMT
Pre bidding and full report now on auction 74.
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Post by pepperpot on Feb 21, 2014 23:44:42 GMT
Two new loans posted, 75 - 5yr@10%, 76 - 6month@1.25%pm, both are relatively small.
75 is open for pre-bids and is 12% funded.
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Post by bracknellboy on Feb 22, 2014 7:49:58 GMT
In the absence of a valuation report on loan 75, lets hope that if push comes to shove lenders don't find that the assets have birds nesting in the nacelles.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Feb 22, 2014 18:42:34 GMT
In the absence of a valuation report on loan 75, lets hope that if push comes to shove lenders don't find that the assets have birds nesting in the nacelles. I expect many -- most? -- of the pre-bids will have come from lenders who just want to reserve themselves a place in the queue should they decide they wish to take part in this loan. Having just put in a small pre-bid myself to gather some info, I learned that only half of the £18k of pre-bids were backed by money in lenders' accounts. (What I don't know is how lenders who could place shadow bids are counted in the calculation. Are their bids treated as funded or unfunded? Perhaps AC -- or anyone else who knows -- would be so kind as to enlighten us.) AC have promised lenders reasonable notice between the time the full credit report is available and an auction opening for bidding. Loan 75 technically has satisfied this requirement, but I would hope that AC consider the valuation report an equally vital bit of information and will not allow an auction to start until a reasonable time after the valuation report is available. There are only a few more hours before this auction is scheduled to start. Are we going to have another last-minute postponement? Or are pre-bidders going to find they've made irrevocable bids without having had a reasonable time to consider all the critical data for this loan? Perhaps AC would like to re-state their position on auction start times relative to the availability of critical data.
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Post by chris on Feb 22, 2014 22:41:02 GMT
Shadow bid ability isn't currently counted in the prebid position rankings, something I do intend to incorporate in but it... complicated things so was skipped until we were happy with performance and stability of that feature. Is on my to do list for after the next major update.
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j
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Post by j on Feb 24, 2014 15:20:23 GMT
Furniture auction now closed, with the twin property sale ones soon to follow. Wonder what's in store next, besides the windy chippy?! The latter being open for only 4 days, maybe some little underwriting expected on that one
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Feb 24, 2014 16:27:27 GMT
Furniture auction now closed, with the twin property sale ones soon to follow. Wonder what's in store next, besides the windy chippy?! The latter being open for only 4 days, maybe some little underwriting expected on that one I can understand the short duration of the chippy auction because the amount being raised is relatively small. But I really don't understand why the auction has been allowed to go live when it is missing such vital information as the valuation report. Not to mention a goodly collection of unanswered questions in the Q&A section of the listing which seem to be very relevant. And at the risk of repeating yself... Earlier, AC promised lenders reasonable notice between the time the full credit report is available and an auction opening for bidding. This loan may appear to have satisfied this requirement, but the report refers to "the attached valuation report" and -- since the valuation report still isn't available -- isn't really complete. I cancelled my pre-bids, and I see that there are nearly £3k of pre-bids that were not funded when the auction went live and still aren't. I wonder if some lenders who placed pre-bids and now have live bids are having second thoughts because of the lack of info and answers. I invite AC to re-state and explain their position on auction start times relative to the availability of critical data.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Feb 24, 2014 22:25:05 GMT
Furniture auction now closed, with the twin property sale ones soon to follow. IIRC, the reason given for extending the closing time for the twin property sale auctions was to allow new lenders to bid out some of the underwriting while waiting for drawdown. That seemed like a plausible reason, though I do question why any lender would choose to place a bid for a loan and commit themselves to earning nothing until drawdown when they could wait until the loan parts appear on the Aftermarket and invest then knowing they'd start earning immediately. In light of this, I have difficulty understanding why the same approach wasn't taken with the furniture auction, which was allowed to close when 65% of the funding still was provided by underwriters. Might it be due to the very limited uptake of further bidding by lenders because of the reason state above?
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bugs4me
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Post by bugs4me on Feb 24, 2014 22:39:17 GMT
Furniture auction now closed, with the twin property sale ones soon to follow. IIRC, the reason given for extending the closing time for the twin property sale auctions was to allow new lenders to bid out some of the underwriting while waiting for drawdown. That seemed like a plausible reason, though I do question why any lender would choose to place a bid for a loan and commit themselves to earning nothing until drawdown when they could wait until the loan parts appear on the Aftermarket and invest then knowing they'd start earning immediately. In light of this, I have difficulty understanding why the same approach wasn't taken with the furniture auction, which was allowed to close when 65% of the funding still was provided by underwriters. Might it be due to the very limited uptake of further bidding by lenders because of the reason state above? I'm adopting a new stance with these larger loans when it's fairly obvious that underwriters will be required. I'll wait in future until the underwriters offload in the aftermarket.
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unmadem
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Post by unmadem on Feb 24, 2014 22:46:46 GMT
I can understand the short duration of the chippy auction because the amount being raised is relatively small. But I really don't understand why the auction has been allowed to go live when it is missing such vital information as the valuation report. Not to mention a goodly collection of unanswered questions in the Q&A section of the listing which seem to be very relevant. I took out my prebids since none of the questioned were answered. Might well go back in if some answers emerge.
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