shimself
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Post by shimself on Jan 22, 2014 10:52:50 GMT
The hypothetical problem with pre bids seems to be becoming real from the outset. The Kidderminster loan Q&A isn't getting any answers, the Info Pack is very brief and is stamped Draft, and yet it's already over 50% subscribed.
I suggest you need to introduce some sort of quality test before opening a loan to pre-bids.
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Post by chris on Jan 22, 2014 11:28:46 GMT
The hypothetical problem with pre bids seems to be becoming real from the outset. The Kidderminster loan Q&A isn't getting any answers, the Info Pack is very brief and is stamped Draft, and yet it's already over 50% subscribed. I suggest you need to introduce some sort of quality test before opening a loan to pre-bids. Andy will have an announcement on this later on today or tomorrow. I have already raised the prospect of delaying the auction start internally and should have a decision shortly.
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Post by batchoy on Jan 22, 2014 12:25:18 GMT
I think the most significant question when a loan would be overfilled by pre bids, which bids get in and which ones don't? If it's in the order the pre bids are created, then we should blindly all rush to create pre bids as soon any loan appears, then take them out at the very last minute if we don't like it. I hate taking things to logical extremes but... Reading chris's original post pre-bids are processed in placement order, so as you suggest their is the potential for a pre-bidding frenzy where lenders a bumped into pre-bidding in order to secure loan parts before the final credit reports and supporting documents have been released and thus the possibility of doing any proper due diligence, which is the key thing that worries me. The ability to cancel pre-bids is sensible, however I feel that this as the potential of exacerbating the problem, with no commitment there is nothing to prevent everyone bidding as soon as the pre-bidding opens. On the face of it pre-bidding solves issue of people missing out as a result of not being available when the auction opens, however it potentially only makes the problem worse by simply moving the issue from the start of the auction to the start of pre-bidding whilst at the same time bumping lenders into making pre-bids without proper DD. Well with just over 3.5 hours to the auction going live we are at nearly 60% pre-bid and nothing more than the draft front page by way of credit report to run DD against. Something tells me if pre-bidding is going to be the norm I am going to have to change the way I bid. If pre-bids are converted to bids on a first come first served basis, and I can only delete them not edit them, then I am going to have to switch from making a single auction bid to making multiple pre-bids so that I can first secure the potential maximum I would be prepared to bid whilst at the same time having the ability to reduce the pre-bid amount based on my DD to a sum that I am happy with without putting myself at the back of the pre-bid queue. All of which puts an additional unnecessary burden on the AC servers once the auction opens.
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unmadem
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Post by unmadem on Jan 22, 2014 13:55:55 GMT
Would it not make sense only to open prebidding when the full credit report (and where appropriate valuation) was available.
This would allow people who were not around when the auction opened to place bids but would not have the effect of reducing due diligence. In the current situation I put in a number of prebids to reserve my place in the queue immediately the prebidding opened and will take one or more of them out if the info emerging causes me doubt. This does not seem to be a desirable way of working.
I do wonder what AC gain by issuing only the cover page of the full credit report. It immediately generates questions many of which would be answered if they had just waited a few days till the full report was available. So time is taken by AC staff to answer question instead of working on the final reports (or we get frustrate by the lack of responses). Plus we do not have the context of the full report with which to critically assess the answers.
Would it not also make sense to have a published minimum period from publication of the full info till the start of auction to encourage due diligence, say 2 days.
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Post by mrclondon on Jan 22, 2014 19:09:29 GMT
chris - are you aware that the horseshoe graphs are no longer correctly reflecting the underwriter parts sold on the secondary market (e.g Optical / CC Lei / Notts property )
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Post by chris on Jan 22, 2014 21:04:55 GMT
chris - are you aware that the horseshoe graphs are no longer correctly reflecting the underwriter parts sold on the secondary market (e.g Optical / CC Lei / Notts property ) Poo bum, my mistake. Forgot to update one function that keeps the stats up to date. The horseshoe is now powered off a different set of figures from the database (absolute investment values rather than relative percentages) which weren't being updated in the same way. This has now been updated and the graphs should reflect the correct figures.
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Post by pepperpot on Jan 22, 2014 21:37:01 GMT
Little niggle - a pre-bid placed this afternoon has a time stamp showing '8 hours ago', yet, one placed this morning is showing '1 day ago'?? I'm sure there's at least 24 hours in a day!
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Post by chris on Jan 22, 2014 21:41:36 GMT
Little niggle - a pre-bid placed this afternoon has a time stamp showing '8 hours ago', yet, one placed this morning is showing '1 day ago'?? I'm sure there's at least 24 hours in a day! I'm not personally a fan of the "8 hours ago" labels but they're used in that case for their compactness. I've flagged this with our front end developer for him to fix.
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Jan 23, 2014 10:03:37 GMT
Shadow bids conked out on Boiler Man...Error  There Was A Problem
There has been an error: missing FROM-clause entry for table "create_bid" LINE 1: ...WHERE bid.auction_id = auc.id AND bid.lender_id = create_bid... ^ QUERY: SELECT sum(bid.actual_amount) FROM bid WHERE bid.auction_id = auc.id AND bid.lender_id = create_bid.lender_id AND status = 'live' CONTEXT: PL/pgSQL function create_shadow_bid(integer,integer,numeric,numeric,bid_priority,boolean,boolean) line 33 at SQL statement
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Post by chris on Jan 23, 2014 10:09:23 GMT
Shadow bids conked out on Boiler Man...Error There Was A Problem
There has been an error: missing FROM-clause entry for table "create_bid" LINE 1: ...WHERE bid.auction_id = auc.id AND bid.lender_id = create_bid... ^ QUERY: SELECT sum(bid.actual_amount) FROM bid WHERE bid.auction_id = auc.id AND bid.lender_id = create_bid.lender_id AND status = 'live' CONTEXT: PL/pgSQL function create_shadow_bid(integer,integer,numeric,numeric,bid_priority,boolean,boolean) line 33 at SQL statement
Sorry, just made a change to fix this. Can you try again?
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Post by mrclondon on Jan 23, 2014 10:10:14 GMT
Compared to oldgrumpy's problem a more minor one:
I refreshed the loan page @ 10:00, saw the bid box appear, typed in the amount (normal not shadow bid) and pressed submit. Received an error message in the alerts banner along the lines of unable to place the bid as the auction was inactive. I retried a few seconds later and the bid was accepted OK.
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Post by batchoy on Jan 23, 2014 10:13:40 GMT
Compared to oldgrumpy's problem a more minor one: I refreshed the loan page @ 10:00, saw the bid box appear, typed in the amount (normal not shadow bid) and pressed submit. Received an error message in the alerts banner along the lines of unable to place the bid as the auction was inactive. I retried a few seconds later and the bid was accepted OK. Had the same problem, it would appear that one part of the system is lagging behind. An error 63 if I remember correctly. Could be a real problem tomorrow if it affects all the pre-bids and so offsets them all by an hour.
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Post by jackpease on Jan 23, 2014 10:15:38 GMT
I waited until a page refresh showed the auction was opened then bid £100 - that was accepted - then £80 - that was accepted - then £60 - accepted - and lastly £40 - accepted. Then i took a breath and the system showed i had bid £100 - the first two bids hadnt gone through. This is not a problem now loans are not filling in seconds! Old Grumpy: Shadow bids were never available to me for Boiler Man - they were to Mister Kidder - but not Boiler Man?  Jack |
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Post by chris on Jan 23, 2014 10:16:13 GMT
Compared to oldgrumpy's problem a more minor one: I refreshed the loan page @ 10:00, saw the bid box appear, typed in the amount (normal not shadow bid) and pressed submit. Received an error message in the alerts banner along the lines of unable to place the bid as the auction was inactive. I retried a few seconds later and the bid was accepted OK. Had the same problem, it would appear that one part of the system is lagging behind. An error 63 if I remember correctly. It's just a difference in clock times between the web server and database server (both driven by NTP but would appear to be a fraction out). I'll get the front end developers to change the box to be powered off the database's clock.
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Jan 23, 2014 10:17:19 GMT
Shadow bids conked out on Boiler Man...Error ......
Sorry, just made a change to fix this. Can you try again? OK now. Thank you. 
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