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Post by batchoy on Feb 8, 2016 15:43:24 GMT
WHAT WE DO
A loan to a friend or family member often results in the loss of both money and relationship especially when it lacks structure and clarity. Our goal here at CircLender is to offer a better solution for friends and family members to help out each other financially. For BorrowerWe make it easy and less awkward for you to crowdsource loans from your social circle. It is as simple as creating a loan request and inviting potential lenders to respond to your request. Key advantages include: - Lower or zero interest
- Faster access to money
- Often no collateral required
Any borrower, be they family or friend, who wasn't prepared to broach the request for a loan in person would would get pretty short shrift from me. I take the view that if you are not prepared to ask me to my face, explain your situation and confirm your ability to pay the loan then I don't want to know, and possibly I don't want to know you any more. - The matter of interest is in the hands of the lender not the borrower, or at least down to mutual agreement so the platform cannot make any claims the use of the platform will give lower or zero interest
- Again not a claim the platform can make. Many on-line loan services in the UK will make offers of loans and deposit funds within hours or even minutes of an application being made. A loan from friends and family will take the time it takes, the platform will not make it any faster for the decision to be made and funds transferred.
- The question of collateral is outside the control of the platform so again the claim is meaningless.
- Having a loan agreement will not prevent disputes, as all the members of the forum know from experience there are borrowers who simply won't pay and even with them being friends and family does not prevent them being non-payers. The key thing with a loan agreement is that it is an agreed legal record of a loan transaction and it is one that should be able to withstand being tested in a court of law. There is no guarantee that CircLender's promissory note complies with the requirements of each of the legal systems that operate in the United Kingdom, and CirLender deny liability for anything and everything associated with their platform. Thus a lender could lend funds thinking they are covered by the promissory note only to find that went they tried to use the English courts the document was null and void in England. As a result they could find themselves loosing the money they had lent and the costs of taking legal action plus they would have no way of recovering their losses from Cirlender for the useless document. If a loan is large enough to warrant a loan agreement then it is worth investing in having one drawn up by someone who understands the legal system where the agreement is being made and has professional indemnity insurance should they fail in drawing up the agreement correctly. The last one I did in England cost me £75, and that included advice to the lender as to the legal implications of the agreement, and answering all of the questions raised.
- Using the system is no guarantee that there will not be misunderstandings as all the processing of the funds is done outside of the platform as possibly will a lot of communication.
- Not using Cirlender is equally as free, and for small amounts where no loan agreement is necessary free for both parties.
- My accounts package tracks my friends and family loans, and tracks repayments using statement data from my bank so no keying or re-keying of information with the potential risk of miss-keying.
- My Accounts package can handle interest calculations for both amortizing and non amortizing loans. Plus I have spreadsheets, and there are many available for free to download, if I need to resort to them for complex loan structures.
- My accounts package can create loan statements backed up by bank records of actual repayments and can create reminders if necessary which I can send on to borrowers.
So to summarise none of the key benefits and features stand up any minimal scrutiny. Plus you are not authorised as a credit broker to operate your service in the UK
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Post by CircLender on Feb 8, 2016 15:55:17 GMT
Hi lynnanthony,
Thank you for your interest in CircLender services!
The services will be made available to 60 countries. The complete listing of these countries can be found at the registration page.
We are now in our beta testing stage and will proceed to business/company incorporation after this.
We are based in Singapore.
Circlender Could you confirm the above statement that you are based in Singapore. I seem to only be able to find the company registered in Kota Kinabalu in Malaysia which seems to be a good 500+ mile swim from Singapore. Even your servers seem to be hosted in Penang in Malaysia, still about 300 miles from Singapore. I am unable to find reference to the company being registered in Singapore so would appreciate if you could clarify this discrepancy. Many thanks Hi lynnanthony, Yes, the company will be based in Singapore. We are finalising the seed round funding with a SG VC at the moment. The website is in beta stage and the beta testing program will end early March. I expect to see a proper setup in 2 months time. I run a building material and property group in Malaysia and also serve as a director of an ASX tech counter. I have business interests in a few countries in the region including Singapore. I picked SG because it will soon become a global fin tech hub at this side of the world. CircLender was initially my hobby project but I receive lots of motivations to bring it to the next level. To me, P2P lending platforms will have to face a reality one day. High NPL and defaults will be a possible threat to end the business model. Stranger to stranger loans through these platforms are very difficult to get good borrowers and it is equally hard to perform credit check on borrowers if the player does not have a banking infrastructure. If a guy willing to pay 18-55% interest to get a loan, it will make more sense for him to go to the bank and get an overdraft account. Unless he is rejected by the bank. If the bank thinks that he might not be able to service a loan, what are the chances for him to borrow thru p2p lending platforms with a high rate and repay the money back safely and timely? You have your answer. I started off CircLender because many ppl in Asia region faced the same set of problems when they borrow from or lend to FF. I think it is a typical problems else where. The problem is simple, if the loan is loosely structured it will surface more misunderstandings over time. So with this in mind, I created a system to help both parties follow through the whole lending process, hoping that I can solve a long term problem in this kind of social lending scenario. It is a niche market but it could be scalable if i manage to do the right thing at the right time. I want this project to kick off because I see the potential for the site to solve a long term problem of FF loans. I hope I explained myself well this time. ps I am not here to scam anyone's money.
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Post by CircLender on Feb 8, 2016 16:03:33 GMT
Batchoy, just ignore the website if u r so uncomfortable with what I am doing. Why spend lots of time here if u think this stuff is so unworkable and useless? Let me tell u one thing, I am not going to stop unless I tried every channel to prove u wrong. Stay tune  |
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Post by oldnick on Feb 8, 2016 16:12:42 GMT
Batchoy, just ignore the website if u r so uncomfortable with what I am doing. Why spend lots of time here if u think this stuff is so unworkable and useless? I am not going stop unless I tried every channel to prove u wrong. Stay tune Hopefully none of the very valuable contributors to this discussion will stop just because their responses are not what you're looking for. This forum is for a wider audience than you seen to assume, and negative feedback is as valuable as any other sort for our readers.
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oldgrumpy
Member of DD Central
Posts: 5,087 
Likes: 3,233
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Post by oldgrumpy on Feb 8, 2016 16:14:05 GMT
Will you be active in China? Maybe you can mop up some of Ding Ning's customers.
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Post by CircLender on Feb 8, 2016 16:20:00 GMT
Batchoy, just ignore the website if u r so uncomfortable with what I am doing. Why spend lots of time here if u think this stuff is so unworkable and useless? I am not going stop unless I tried every channel to prove u wrong. Stay tune Hopefully none of the very valuable contributors to this discussion will stop just because their responses are not what you're looking for. This forum is for a wider audience than you seen to assume, and negative feedback is as valuable as any other sort for our readers. Well, that's ok for me. this forum is full of sophisticated people who share common interest in finance and technology. I am hoping to bump into people that share the same wavelength with me. for those that have different views, I am OK to continue our conversation. Not a big deal.
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ben
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Post by ben on Feb 8, 2016 16:22:02 GMT
Also do not forget with friends/family its not always about the money, when it comes to family common sense quite often does not come into it
I will use my brother in law as an example, he is married has 2 children a decent ish job, enough for him to live on, however he is completely hopeless with money and has an remarkable ability to get himself into debt, and guess who ends up bailing him out time and again, racks up debts that Greece would be proud of.
If it was my brother I would not give him a penny unless he could prove to me he was not going to get into the same situation again, no point throwing good money after bad and just giving a handout helps nothing, however my wife agrees in principle but in practice would not see her nephews suffers so gives him the money knowing full well that even though he says he will pay it back he never would and it is wasted. He is also well aware of this so although he swears he will change his way and pay it back all concerned knows this is never going to happen.
Think if I suggested managing any money given to him through a site like yours I would be on the sofa
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ben
Posts: 2,020
Likes: 589
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Post by ben on Feb 8, 2016 16:24:21 GMT
Hopefully none of the very valuable contributors to this discussion will stop just because their responses are not what you're looking for. This forum is for a wider audience than you seen to assume, and negative feedback is as valuable as any other sort for our readers. Well, that's ok for me. this forum is full of sophisticated people who share common interest in finance and technology. I am hoping to bump into people that share the same wavelength with me. for those that have different views, I am OK to continue our conversation. Not a big deal. I doubt you will find anyone on here willing to actually use your services but you will probably find some good advice
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Post by CircLender on Feb 8, 2016 16:25:18 GMT
Will you be active in China? Maybe you can mop up some of Ding Ning's customers. Hi oldgrumpy, China is a huge market with 1.9B internet users. It is my priority to enter the market. The Chinese version of CircLender is on the way. Pity those who got scammed by unethical players. If they still believe in p2p model, I hope they can consider using CircLender.
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Post by CircLender on Feb 8, 2016 16:28:49 GMT
Well, that's ok for me. this forum is full of sophisticated people who share common interest in finance and technology. I am hoping to bump into people that share the same wavelength with me. for those that have different views, I am OK to continue our conversation. Not a big deal. I doubt you will find anyone on here willing to actually use your services but you will probably find some good advice That will be good enough. I quite appreciate the feedback (including those sarcastic one) gathered from this forum.
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Post by CircLender on Feb 8, 2016 16:36:19 GMT
Also do not forget with friends/family its not always about the money, when it comes to family common sense quite often does not come into it I will use my brother in law as an example, he is married has 2 children a decent ish job, enough for him to live on, however he is completely hopeless with money and has an remarkable ability to get himself into debt, and guess who ends up bailing him out time and again, racks up debts that Greece would be proud of. If it was my brother I would not give him a penny unless he could prove to me he was not going to get into the same situation again, no point throwing good money after bad and just giving a handout helps nothing, however my wife agrees in principle but in practice would not see her nephews suffers so gives him the money knowing full well that even though he says he will pay it back he never would and it is wasted. He is also well aware of this so although he swears he will change his way and pay it back all concerned knows this is never going to happen. Think if I suggested managing any money given to him through a site like yours I would be on the sofa In your scenario, you can use the best available tools on earth but still lose your money if your bro did not pay u back. Let's think of other scenario that people might use CircLender... Parents help children pay off high interest bearing credit cards, they might need a tracking system Business partners help out each other in a short term financial fix, they might need both the promissory note and a tracker. you need money for your wedding expenses and confident that u can pay back in 12 months time, etc... You secured funds from 10 of your friends and the system helps u keep track of the repayment schedules for all of the lenders... As an entrepreneur, I find ways to locate my markets. Not the other way round.
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Post by batchoy on Feb 8, 2016 16:59:27 GMT
Also do not forget with friends/family its not always about the money, when it comes to family common sense quite often does not come into it I will use my brother in law as an example, he is married has 2 children a decent ish job, enough for him to live on, however he is completely hopeless with money and has an remarkable ability to get himself into debt, and guess who ends up bailing him out time and again, racks up debts that Greece would be proud of. If it was my brother I would not give him a penny unless he could prove to me he was not going to get into the same situation again, no point throwing good money after bad and just giving a handout helps nothing, however my wife agrees in principle but in practice would not see her nephews suffers so gives him the money knowing full well that even though he says he will pay it back he never would and it is wasted. He is also well aware of this so although he swears he will change his way and pay it back all concerned knows this is never going to happen. Think if I suggested managing any money given to him through a site like yours I would be on the sofa In your scenario, you can use the best available tools on earth but still lose your money if your bro did not pay u back. Let's think off other scenario that people might use CircLender... Parents help children pay off high interest bearing credit cards, Business partners help out each other in a short term financial fix, you need money for your wedding expenses and confident that u can pay back in 12 months time, etc... As an entrepreneur, I find ways to locate my markets. Not the other way round. None of your scenarios are any different to Ben's particularly so the first one and using the tools Circlender provides does not reduce the risk of non-repayment. Picking up on your comments to lynnanthony, you clearly have very jaundiced view of P2P lending and little understanding of the unsecured personal P2P lending in the UK. Whilst your site may have a place in parts of Asia but that is still open to question, I don't believe it offers anything of substance in Europe or North America, and would probably need authorisations from the the local financial regulators for the brokering services that it does provide.
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oldgrumpy
Member of DD Central
Posts: 5,087
Likes: 3,233
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Post by oldgrumpy on Feb 8, 2016 17:04:13 GMT
It seems you may be counting on avoiding P2P regulation because you are not handling any of our money except your fee.
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Post by CircLender on Feb 8, 2016 17:12:52 GMT
It seems you may be counting on avoiding P2P regulation because you are not handling any of our money except your fee. CircLender offering is simple, 5 bucks for the users to better manage a typical FF loan. The loan can have multiple lenders and we formalise the arrangements with each of them. We also help the borrower to keep tracks of repayment with all the lenders which might have different due dates and terms. I consider CircLender a solution provider. It is not a lending platform and we are not handling ppl money. So, P2P regulations might not be applicable in our case.
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Post by CircLender on Feb 8, 2016 17:22:23 GMT
In your scenario, you can use the best available tools on earth but still lose your money if your bro did not pay u back. Let's think off other scenario that people might use CircLender... Parents help children pay off high interest bearing credit cards, Business partners help out each other in a short term financial fix, you need money for your wedding expenses and confident that u can pay back in 12 months time, etc... As an entrepreneur, I find ways to locate my markets. Not the other way round. None of your scenarios are any different to Ben's particularly so the first one and using the tools Circlender provides does not reduce the risk of non-repayment. Picking up on your comments to lynnanthony, you clearly have very jaundiced view of P2P lending and little understanding of the unsecured personal P2P lending in the UK. Whilst your site may have a place in parts of Asia but that is still open to question, I don't believe it offers anything of substance in Europe or North America, and would probably need authorisations from the the local financial regulators for the brokering services that it does provide. With the recent warning of NPL in US based LendingClub, I am quite convinced that what direction p2p platforms are heading. I might be wrong, so just wait a little bit longer and see. No point arguing right now. I have beta testers from Europe and the North America that have different views. They think I have a viable business model. Not all of them are as "sophisticated" as u I guess. Asia is definitely my main markets but Europe and US are equally important to me. I will find ways to enter these markets, don't worry. In your earlier comment, you told me that my services are no different than using an excel spreadsheet. And now u are telling me that my services might be subject to financial regulations in your country. are u telling me UK is regulating the use of spreadsheet right now?
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