jonah
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Post by jonah on Jun 28, 2016 21:46:56 GMT
You may be correct. Time will tell.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Jun 29, 2016 8:09:39 GMT
But given a Brexit vote the restoration of fishing rights is a non-negotiable. Another fine example of the electorate not actually having the first clue what the reality behind the fluffy sound-bite was. Currently, British fishermen have access to this amount of water... If they're restricted to UK waters, they'll have access to THIS amount of water... (Plus international water, of course, along with everybody else) And, just because we leave the CFP (which we joined separately, and earlier, to the EC), doesn't actually mean that there'll be any more fish in that water, so quotas will still have to be in place to ensure no over-fishing. No, "But they never wanted to fish in the rest of the European waters they had access to" is not a good excuse. That just says that British fishermen are idle gits who couldn't be bothered to walk further than the corner shop, while spending the last forty years moaning about the prices and lack of choice there. And if Farridge gave the first flying fish about fisheries, perhaps he could have started showing it by turning up to the other 96% of meetings while he was on the fisheries committee of the European parliament?
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Steerpike
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Post by Steerpike on Jun 29, 2016 8:20:29 GMT
Landings of fish in the UK are about 50% of what they were before Brentry in 1973.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Jun 29, 2016 8:23:26 GMT
Landings of fish in the UK are about 50% of what they were before Brentry in 1973. Primarily because we've learnt a hell of a lot about conservation and stock management in that time. If we'd continued unfettered, there wouldn't be any fish left at all.
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Steerpike
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Post by Steerpike on Jun 29, 2016 9:59:12 GMT
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Jun 29, 2016 10:08:12 GMT
"Leave campaigner plays down risks of leaving during campaigning". Hold the front page.
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Post by propman on Jun 29, 2016 13:31:05 GMT
Landings of fish in the UK are about 50% of what they were before Brentry in 1973. Primarily because we've learnt a hell of a lot about conservation and stock management in that time. If we'd continued unfettered, there wouldn't be any fish left at all. Also, fish quotas could be sold and a large proportion of those allocated to UK were sold off to other nations' ships.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Jun 29, 2016 13:32:28 GMT
Primarily because we've learnt a hell of a lot about conservation and stock management in that time. If we'd continued unfettered, there wouldn't be any fish left at all. Also, fish quotas could be sold and a large proportion of those allocated to UK were sold off to other nations' ships. So, umm, who sold them?
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skippyonspeed
Some people think I'm a little bit crazy, but I know my mind's not hazy
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Post by skippyonspeed on Jun 29, 2016 13:52:58 GMT
Also, fish quotas could be sold and a large proportion of those allocated to UK were sold off to other nations' ships. So, umm, who sold them? I know trading of Individual Fish Quotas IFQs can be traded in some parts of the world. However, not sure if it is allowed within the EU. Even if it was I would hope it would only be permissible between individuals of the same nation.
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Bagman
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Post by Bagman on Jun 29, 2016 14:11:30 GMT
Lots of good information on fish quotas here from our perspective down in Cornwall.
www.duchyfishquota.co.uk/who-we-are/issue/
In summary , yes fish quotas are tradable and there is a problem with the current quotas being aggregated by larger and not necessarily UK companies.
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Jun 29, 2016 14:13:40 GMT
At least we could change the rules that mean if you accidentally catch some of the 'wrong' fish you have to throw them back dead!
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Jun 29, 2016 14:17:31 GMT
Actually I think we/they already fixed that. 8>.
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skippyonspeed
Some people think I'm a little bit crazy, but I know my mind's not hazy
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Post by skippyonspeed on Jun 29, 2016 14:22:09 GMT
Actually I think we/they already fixed that. 8>. I think they have trained kissing gouramis to give mouth to mouth resus.
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Post by meledor on Jun 29, 2016 15:43:28 GMT
But given a Brexit vote the restoration of fishing rights is a non-negotiable. Another fine example of the electorate not actually having the first clue what the reality behind the fluffy sound-bite was. Currently, British fishermen have access to this amount of water... If they're restricted to UK waters, they'll have access to THIS amount of water... (Plus international water, of course, along with everybody else) And, just because we leave the CFP (which we joined separately, and earlier, to the EC), doesn't actually mean that there'll be any more fish in that water, so quotas will still have to be in place to ensure no over-fishing. No, "But they never wanted to fish in the rest of the European waters they had access to" is not a good excuse. That just says that British fishermen are idle gits who couldn't be bothered to walk further than the corner shop, while spending the last forty years moaning about the prices and lack of choice there. And if Farridge gave the first flying fish about fisheries, perhaps he could have started showing it by turning up to the other 96% of meetings while he was on the fisheries committee of the European parliament?
Nice maps, but a completely false impression is given that there is free market in fishing - a British trawler can fish anywhere it likes in the EU waters. This is not how the CFP works; it is based on national quotas that are set in Brussels. If you haven't got a quota for that area or you have exceeded it you can't fish.
The other thing the maps do not show is that 70% of fish caught in the EU is in British waters. So again the impression from the statement "British fishermen have access to this amount of water.." that we are somehow going to be worse off is erroneous.
It is worth quoting Labour MP Austin Mitchell (the quote is in the Taxpayer Alliance link in my earlier post - page 34)
“We must recognise that the common fisheries policy has been expensive for Britain. There is no use ignoring reality and pretending that it will go away. If we calculate the total EU catch to be 5.3 million tonnes of fish and its value to be £5.6 billion, with 70 per cent. of fish caught in British waters—what used to be exclusive British waters— and we deduct from 70 per cent. of £5.6 billion the £645 million that is the value of landings in this country, we are left with £3.3 billion. The fish are caught in our waters, though not by our vessels—thereby not providing employment in this country—and sold in Europe. That is the effect of the common fisheries policy. We have been swindled, and the policy was devised for that purpose.”
So re-establishing control over British fishing rights will lead to Britain getting control over £3.3 billion worth of fish a year.
And no we did not join the CFP prior to joining the EU. The CFP was created in 1970 by the French and agreed by the six members of the EU as a resource grab because it knew that the UK along with Denmark, Ireland and Norway were looking to join the EU. So when we joined (sensibly Norway changed its mind because of the CFP) Ted Heath gave away our fishing rights.
And as for Farage (not Farridge) not attending, can you tell me when a fishing committee has ever met to consider giving back the fishing rights the EU stole? If not what was the point in Farage attending?
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Jun 29, 2016 15:51:59 GMT
Nice maps, but a completely false impression is given that there is free market in fishing - a British trawler can fish anywhere it likes in the EU waters. This is not how the CFP works; it is based on national quotas that are set in Brussels. If you haven't got a quota for that area or you have exceeded it you can't fish. Yep. Just as applies for everybody else. In 13% of the waters? Sounds like a load of pollock to me, but I'm sure you can demonstrate it... Oh, fertheloveofcod... BTW... fullfact.org/europe/eu-pinching-our-fish/ - but I s'pose you'll just throw that back as having some kind of inherent bias.
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