blender
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Post by blender on Aug 24, 2016 16:19:24 GMT
Unlikely. Ablrate may own the asset as security but the borrower is responsible for the repayment, and has use of the asset. Ablrate would need to gain physical possession of the containers and liquidate them before the proceeds would be paid as recoveries. P2P operators never take that sort of risk - it's really part of the definition. But you might argue that Ablrate should always be able to locate its property for the security to be meaningful. Sure they are working hard at it. Wish them well.
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Post by meledor on Aug 24, 2016 17:49:04 GMT
Nevertheless it would useful to know more of what has happened. Do Ablrate Assets Ltd still own the containers? Or has ownership been tranferred to the borrower during the voyage? If the latter why is there no charge registered at Companies House? Has the ship carrying these containers reached its port? If so when? Which port was the destination?
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littleoldlady
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Post by littleoldlady on Aug 24, 2016 20:29:52 GMT
Nevertheless it would useful to know more of what has happened. Do Ablrate Assets Ltd still own the containers? Or has ownership been tranferred to the borrower during the voyage? If the latter why is there no charge registered at Companies House? Has the ship carrying these containers reached its port? If so when? Which port was the destination? Certainly my thinking at present is that Ablrate said they were purchasing the containers (using lenders funds) and ownership would pass to C****h*m when the charge was registered. As no charge has been registered, my view is that Abl "owns" the containers and therefore are liable to repay the loan. If forcing Abl to repay the loan led to platform failure then all the other loans would be in jeopardy. Edit 25/10/2018 If we had known then that there would be no progress in the following 2 and a bit years. Edit 17/3/2021: Make that 5 years
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blender
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Post by blender on Aug 24, 2016 21:07:57 GMT
Nevertheless it would useful to know more of what has happened. Do Ablrate Assets Ltd still own the containers? Or has ownership been tranferred to the borrower during the voyage? If the latter why is there no charge registered at Companies House? Has the ship carrying these containers reached its port? If so when? Which port was the destination? Certainly my thinking at present is that Ablrate said they were purchasing the containers (using lenders funds) and ownership would pass to C****h*m when the charge was registered. As no charge has been registered, my view is that Abl "owns" the containers and therefore are liable to repay the loan. It does not matter who owns the containers. The loan contract is with the borrower. On the FC platform, for example, there are loans where the asset purchased is owned by FC on behalf of the lenders. That does not make FC liable to repay the loan.
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littleoldlady
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Post by littleoldlady on Aug 25, 2016 12:02:11 GMT
Good points Deees . It may be that a Court will decide that Abl have been negligent and so clause 20.1 of the T&C applies. Another point is that if Abl own the containers then they appear to have been stolen and it becomes a criminal rather than a civil matter. Perhaps Abl should go to the police. |
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stevio
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Post by stevio on Aug 31, 2016 10:11:32 GMT
Good points Deees . It may be that a Court will decide that Abl have been negligent and so clause 20.1 of the T&C applies. Another point is that if Abl own the containers then they appear to have been stolen and it becomes a criminal rather than a civil matter. Perhaps Abl should go to the police. It might be an easier way of obtaining the security! If the transaction side of this has not been implemented properly, it could impede legal progress Although Ablrate might be able to explain what happened here
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Post by meledor on Aug 31, 2016 10:44:00 GMT
It would be useful to get some answers to the questions I raised on this thread a week ago. Namely:
Do Ablrate Assets Ltd still own the containers? (The implication from the absence of a registered charge is that it does, but it would be useful to get confirmation of this).
Has the ship carrying these containers reached its port? If so when? Which port was the destination?
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Aug 31, 2016 10:47:07 GMT
Were the containers actually made in the first place, let alone shipped?
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littleoldlady
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Post by littleoldlady on Aug 31, 2016 11:34:04 GMT
Received email. Basically the case is just slowly going through the court process. Abl seem to be on top of things on that side but say nothing about what if anything they are doing to locate the containers, which may or may not be their property, but if not are the security for the loan.
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Aug 31, 2016 13:44:29 GMT
Were the containers actually made in the first place, let alone shipped? As Ablrate made payment directly to the manufacturer, they could simply email them and ask for the container numbers and which ship they were loaded onto.. Using the numbers, you can access a database which will show you the route the containers took and where they were finally landed. It's certainly not rocket science.As ablrate used the lenders money to purchase these containers directly and undertook, in writing as part of the loan proposal, not to pass ownership until a charge had been registered against them, I expect ablrate to repay the loan on 18th September. Ablrate did not follow the agreed procedure and is therefore liable to repay the lenders. Absolutely, so why haven't ABL confirmed that they have done this? Simple. Therefore it is not simple, and I wonder ... were the containers actually made, let alone given numbers?
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Post by ablrate on Aug 31, 2016 14:33:25 GMT
Hi All
As you can imagine, we are in still in legals with the borrower to have discussion on a public forum is counterproductive to our case. There are a number of elements to this loan that we simply cannot discuss because of the ongoing legal process, to do so may affect our case, especially the matters surrounding security and the processes. I understand that lenders are keen to get a result, believe me, so are we but we have to let the legal process take its course and discussing the case in detail will only make our stance weaker and give the borrower more information with which to cloud the waters.
We have been sending updates out and I know some are having issues (which we have addressed on another thread) but I would ask for your patience while we work very hard to bring this mater to a close. I may be making a rod for our own back here, but we have pursued this debt vigorously (some say far more than other platforms do) and we will find a solution to make sure lenders do not lose out.
Regards
Ablrate
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shimself
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Post by shimself on Aug 31, 2016 15:17:53 GMT
In the light of what from the outside looks like villainy perpetrated by the borrower I think we should do as ABL ask and not go into any detail here.
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Post by Lep Recorn on Sept 1, 2016 11:36:55 GMT
ablrate said ". . . we will find a solution to make sure lenders do not lose out."
This seems either to be a rash promise, or a promise that Ablrate will make up any shortfall??
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2016 12:07:50 GMT
ablrate said ". . . we will find a solution to make sure lenders do not lose out." This seems either to be a rash promise, or a promise that Ablrate will make up any shortfall?? This is such a small loan, that its possible Ablrate may prefer to take the financial hit than the reputational hit from a small default. But thats just speculation.
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ianj
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Post by ianj on Sept 2, 2016 11:41:08 GMT
Let's just hope that when/if our containers are eventually located that they're not on a Hanjin Shipping vessel, as reported here!  |
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