pfffill
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Post by pfffill on Nov 16, 2020 2:56:58 GMT
FS filed a winding up petition against this one 21/9/20 Receivers (3) appointed 16/10/20 Though no update on the FS website....
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pfffill
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Post by pfffill on Nov 16, 2020 12:36:31 GMT
Lost my participation on this one. Just posting this to get it back. I've pencilled in a 70% return on capital with total loss of interest on this one, based on the rejected £1m + 2nd charge offer and less receivers' expenses etc now we're on that route. C&G reckoned they could do better. We shall see.
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criston
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Post by criston on Nov 16, 2020 13:44:47 GMT
FS filed a winding up petition against this one 21/9/20 Receivers (3) appointed 16/10/20 Where do you pick up this information
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Nov 16, 2020 14:03:49 GMT
FS filed a winding up petition against this one 21/9/20 Receivers (3) appointed 16/10/20 Where do you pick up this information The WUP came from CE-file court records which I sometimes look at in case Mousey has missed something  The IP appointments came from companies house For some reason the gazette doesnt seem to be getting the notices.
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Mousey
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Post by Mousey on Nov 16, 2020 20:03:24 GMT
The WUP came from CE-file court records which I sometimes look at in case Mousey has missed something Haha! I've just done my check and posted that in DDC.
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iRobot
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Post by iRobot on Dec 17, 2020 11:49:24 GMT
Fairly comprehensive update:
Interesting that Admin are considering a build-out option; suggests they're not taking the easiest option but are looking for the best overall return for lenders - and, of course, by extension, themselves and hopefully other creditors, too.
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adrian77
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Post by adrian77 on Dec 17, 2020 12:01:11 GMT
I don't think FS have finished a single development to date but always a first time - personally I would not take this one on as I am not convinced this mini property boom if going to last much longer but may well be wrong. However what happens is they do finish it and they end up not recovering all of the loan - well that would be interesting. FS should never have got into this mess - as I have said before having to sell a part-finished project is a nightmare for most developers.
So they either sell with a potential hefty discount for it not being finished or they finish it and risk taking a loss or making a profit
An interesting one to follow - this is in my top 40 so it may come good and I am wrong...for the investors I hope I am
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criston
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Post by criston on Dec 17, 2020 12:41:53 GMT
Fairly comprehensive update: Interesting that Admin are considering a build-out option; suggests they're not taking the easiest option but are looking for the best overall return for lenders - and, of course, by extension, themselves and hopefully other creditors, too. I note your previous post saying 'At that point the accumulated tranches amounted to £1,178,300 of a £1.4m facility against a £3m GDV.' I have currently set a loss of capital & interest on my investment at 50%. However, if the Administrators organise it's completion, the selling price could well see substantially more available, obviously dependant on builders finishing quote. I wonder how honest the earlier refinance offer of £1m was ?
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pfffill
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Post by pfffill on Dec 17, 2020 12:49:14 GMT
I don't think FS have finished a single development to date but always a first time - personally I would not take this one on as I am not convinced this mini property boom if going to last much longer but may well be wrong. However what happens is they do finish it and they end up not recovering all of the loan - well that would be interesting. FS should never have got into this mess - as I have said before having to sell a part-finished project is a nightmare for most developers. So they either sell with a potential hefty discount for it not being finished or they finish it and risk taking a loss or making a profit An interesting one to follow - this is in my top 40 so it may come good and I am wrong...for the investors I hope I am "...as I am not convinced this mini property boom if going to last much longer but may well be wrong." This is a fairly unique property so C&G may well be thinking that price in this niche segment of the market may hold up, and that it's hence worth completing. In any event, I long ago pencilled in a thirty percent loss of capital on this, but while today's update does seem to me to give slight reason for more optimism, it looks like a 70% return will be at the upper end ultimately.
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adrian77
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Post by adrian77 on Dec 17, 2020 13:13:45 GMT
very good point - I agree niche properties can do very well but it depends on the local market and I think generally take longer to sell because of the high price
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criston
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Post by criston on Dec 17, 2020 17:29:15 GMT
How was the original GDV of £3m arrived at, when the completed development is now valued at £1m to £1.25m.
If there was a genuine refinance offer of £1m, the valuation must have been approaching £1.5 to £2m.
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adrian77
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Post by adrian77 on Dec 17, 2020 18:24:20 GMT
Just a point - if FS finish this one won't they be liable to CGT (tell me about it!) and we all know about builders' estimates...
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iRobot
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Post by iRobot on Dec 17, 2020 18:31:43 GMT
Just a point - if FS finish this one won't they be liable to CGT ( tell me about it!) and we all know about builders' estimates... Huh?!?!? Professional property developers don't pay CGT - instead they pay:
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adrian77
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Post by adrian77 on Dec 17, 2020 20:49:43 GMT
thanks for the advice - I think it will find it depends on your nationality where you are resident for tax purposes - I paid CGT last year and I am getting another CGT demand next week. This is what my accountant advises...Not sure if how FS would be taxed for any profit they make but all ears...
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pfffill
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Post by pfffill on Jan 29, 2021 14:00:40 GMT
Right dog's dinner, this one. Looks like another year or two:
"Further to the last update, it is understood that the associated costs of completion in addition to settlement of the former contractors arrears (which would be required for completion) are substantial, in the region of £466,000+. Furthermore, it is understood that there are still several compliance points to address before planning direction is satisfied along with various testing and compliance that is required to satisfy building regulations. The borrower is also awaiting the PCC, without which, there may be the necessity to purchase a retrospective third party guarantee, which further increases costs. The surveyor has also advised of the overall site complications, due to its remote location. As such, we await the receivers recommendations with regard to progression and steps available for recovery. The same will hopefully be provided in our next update."
I think I'll revise my capital return estimate, in light of the above, to 50% max, very likely less.
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