SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Aug 28, 2017 9:16:20 GMT
please private message me your accountant details. i am looking to get advice. Sorry, I can't help you as I handle all my accounting "in house" but, being brutally honest, I can't see existing company lenders wanting to link you up with their accountants (a relationship likely built carefully over many years) if you're not at least conversant with the basics of lending via a limited company and why you think you want / need to do it. Perhaps phone a few other firms in your area and ask something like "Do you have experience of handling companies that earn their income from funding and trading peer-to-peer loans to other businesses?". I doubt that many will, but some may at least be willing to consider and research the proposition professionally (likely for a fee!).
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Post by elephantrosie on Aug 28, 2017 23:43:58 GMT
Thanks for the honest reply. I do not know much about lending via a ltd company, therefore would like to speak to accountants about it. i personally have a ltd company in another business, but my accountant do not know much about lending via a ltd company. so looking to jump boats. anyways, i will take up your advice and call up a few accounting firms. cheers.
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Post by jackpease on Aug 29, 2017 7:02:34 GMT
I invest in p2p both as an individual and through my ltd company to park accrued income (subs paid up front). Accountants don't like the complication of p2p but I use cloud accounting software (xero) and set up each p2p as a 'bank account' which makes it easier for them to grasp the big picture.
What they really don't like is the inability for p2p to tally, eg FC has all sorts of double payments and lost this and that and the end of year tax statements rarely tally. When they ask to check the source and send them the transactions, I refuse as i suspect i'd be charged to look through tens of thousands of transactions that will raise dozens of disparities.
It's critical to take end of **business** year (not tax year) screen shots as it is very hard if not impossible to retrospectively work out a balance for a particular date in the past.
As the dividend tax bites, I no longer think my ltd company p2p is any less taxed than my individual p2p investments.
Jack P
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Aug 29, 2017 10:33:08 GMT
My 2p worth from my own experience (note I am not a financial expert):
- companies make much more sense if you can utilise Entrepreneurs Relief at the end to extract money. This is not possible with an investment company (which a primary p2p vehicle would be). However, if p2p is just a small part of an otherwise trading company, ER could still be an option (but note ER has been restricted recently to avoid phoenix company/phoenix sole trader activity).
- companies will have an advantage if you aren't earning anything from any other source, so can pay some salary free of NI/income tax.
- finally, companies have a role if your marginal rate of tax is likely to lower significantly in the future when you take money out.
- there are probably complex arrangements/offshore etc for people with residence/domicile flexibility that I don't pretend to understand and which won't apply to most people and are harder in recent years and probably only for very HNW people with specialist advice.
If none of the above apply, the tax differences of using a company are now marginal and probably offset by the hassle and extra accounting expenses, and the fact that what you earn will be publicly available to all prying eyes.
IFISAs much more useful and straightforward to minimise p2p earnings tax IMHO.
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Post by valueinvestor123 on Sept 1, 2017 13:18:03 GMT
Sorry for stupid question but what does 'retaining profits' via a limited company mean in practice? Would the company have to pay 20% corp tax on all interest received before it can be reinvested back or whatever is reinvested back does not attract any tax? I always assumed it is the former which means that one would have to earn over 150k pa in order to make the ltd option more attractive. Could someone clarify please?
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Sept 1, 2017 13:41:26 GMT
Sorry for stupid question but what does 'retaining profits' via a limited company mean in practice? Would the company have to pay 20% corp tax on all interest received before it can be reinvested back or whatever is reinvested back does not attract any tax? I always assumed it is the former which means that one would have to earn over 150k pa in order to make the ltd option more attractive. Could someone clarify please? Yes, companies pay corporation tax on their taxable net profit (income minus operating expenses, such as salaries / office costs / etc.). The resulting post-tax profit is either retained on the balance sheet (within the company) or paid out to the shareholders as Dividends.
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Post by valueinvestor123 on Sept 1, 2017 13:50:44 GMT
Sorry for stupid question but what does 'retaining profits' via a limited company mean in practice? Would the company have to pay 20% corp tax on all interest received before it can be reinvested back or whatever is reinvested back does not attract any tax? I always assumed it is the former which means that one would have to earn over 150k pa in order to make the ltd option more attractive. Could someone clarify please? Yes, companies pay corporation tax on their taxable net profit (income minus operating expenses, such as salaries / office costs / etc.). The resulting post-tax profit is either retained on the balance sheet (within the company) or paid out to the shareholders as Dividends. Thanks, in order not to hijack the thread, I expanded on a separate thread: p2pindependentforum.com/thread/9943/tax-efficient-income-portfolio-question
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Post by elephantrosie on Sept 10, 2017 12:24:00 GMT
i super like your username, valueinvestor! thats my dream job anyway back to more serious question- those of you who use pre-existing limited company (for another business) to invest in p2p, do you have to open a separate bank accounts for p2p trading?
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duck
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Post by duck on Sept 10, 2017 13:56:38 GMT
i super like your username, valueinvestor! thats my dream job anyway back to more serious question- those of you who use pre-existing limited company (for another business) to invest in p2p, do you have to open a separate bank accounts for p2p trading? I use the same bank account for trade and investment and have done so for the best part of 20 years.
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Post by elephantrosie on Sept 10, 2017 20:36:47 GMT
thanks duck.
i presume you mean your company's bank account?
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duck
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Post by duck on Sept 11, 2017 5:22:33 GMT
Yes the Company bank account.
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Post by jackpease on Sept 11, 2017 6:31:07 GMT
>does your ltd company have a separate bank account No - I'm not sure why you would especially as company accounts often need to be paid for. Its your accountant that is the biggest hurdle with p2p, not the taxman imho. I have a handful of p2p accounts, many of which are now legacy accounts with bad debts just sitting there. I don't try to claim against trivial bad debts as it prompts a load of demands for paperwork from the accountant which may not be available or indeed tally. Jack P
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Post by elephantrosie on Sept 11, 2017 17:35:17 GMT
if i have a sum of cash in my personal account to invest, how do i invest it through my ltd company? do i have to transfer it to my companys bank account? or can i invest directly from my personal account and only to put it under companys name when it comes to doing the tax at the end of the year?
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Sept 11, 2017 17:44:52 GMT
As a Director of a Close Company, you could make a loan to your own company, but the funds would then becone part of the company assets (with a corresponding liability to you). Life gets complicated if you try to pay yourself interest on such a loan so best keep it interest free. However, if you have borrowed the money in your personal capacity specifically to lend it to the company then you can offset interest you are paying on it against your other personal income. All this needs careful documentation, however, and the funds would have to be moved into the company bank account. Consult your Accountant first.
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Post by elephantrosie on Sept 11, 2017 20:13:52 GMT
great. thanks.
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