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Post by wildlife2 on Oct 11, 2020 19:10:23 GMT
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mrk
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Post by mrk on Oct 11, 2020 19:15:49 GMT
8 days from requesting a test to getting the results frankly makes the whole system almost pointless. The main delay was that the pack took 5 days to arrive (I assume part of the problem with the Roche warehouse delays).
Given that the test material goes both ways in the post it is obviously not going to be a rapid process.
Using home testing kits sent by post seems mostly a way to inflate the numbers so we can boast about doing "more tests than any other country". Too much focus on a single numerical target ("X thousands daily tests") missing the wider picture.
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Oct 11, 2020 19:29:00 GMT
I must admit my view does fluctuate a fair bit but one constant is a dislike of the scientific community presenting evidence and projections as close to fact. I also very much dislike a lot of what the government is doing/has done but the bottom line is if your scientists tell you X thousand people might die if you don't do Y then they have to do it.
Somebody, some adult in the room, needs to really attempt to consider all this in the round. They need to weigh up not just economic costs but also other deaths, lack of health, eduction, social stress, mental health etc etc vs deaths from covid. They also need stop presenting figures in a certain way to support their policies. Of course the scientists focus 100% on direct deaths from covd but someone, i.e. the government should be able to see the full picture.
Is our response the right one or have we (most of the world) gone barking mad? Only time will tell. I'm starting to lean towards the latter.
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benaj
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Post by benaj on Oct 11, 2020 20:10:46 GMT
1. Lodger decided (and I agreed) that her symptoms warranted requesting a test on Thursday the 1st October 4. Test result was provided, I think by email, on Friday the 9th October. 8 days from requesting a test to getting the results frankly makes the whole system almost pointless. There is no system in place to activate circuit breaker when the system takes too long get a test. There is no capacity to test 500,000 a day yet. The UK has processed more than 22 mil samples and yet cannot keep covid under control! The objective of testing isn’t about keeping population safe and it is nothing clear about it.
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Post by Ton ⓉⓞⓃ on Oct 11, 2020 20:42:13 GMT
I must admit my view does fluctuate a fair bit but one constant is a dislike of the scientific community presenting evidence and projections as close to fact. I also very much dislike a lot of what the government is doing/has done but the bottom line is if your scientists tell you X thousand people might die if you don't do Y then they have to do it. Somebody, some adult in the room, needs to really attempt to consider all this in the round. They need to weigh up not just economic costs but also other deaths, lack of health, eduction, social stress, mental health etc etc vs deaths from covid. They also need stop presenting figures in a certain way to support their policies. Of course the scientists focus 100% on direct deaths from covd but someone, i.e. the government should be able to see the full picture. Is our response the right one or have we (most of the world) gone barking mad? Only time will tell. I'm starting to lean towards the latter.
But people (voters) dying in hospitals is so much more visceral than an almost notional harm caused by people being "locked" in their houses where the results are months even years down the line with people not even realizing they are depressed or having PTSD
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mrk
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Post by mrk on Oct 11, 2020 20:53:25 GMT
Is our response the right one or have we (most of the world) gone barking mad? Only time will tell. I'm starting to lean towards the latter. Time will tell indeed. So far I'm glad I'm not in Manaus, Brazil but I'd rather be in Wellington, New Zealand.
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Post by dan1 on Oct 11, 2020 21:10:59 GMT
Is our response the right one or have we (most of the world) gone barking mad? Only time will tell. I'm starting to lean towards the latter. Time will tell indeed. So far I'm glad I'm not in Manaus, Brazil but I'd rather be in Wellington, New Zealand. First it was the Chinese taking the **** with their pool parties, now it's the bloody Kiwis with their rugby crowds. Grrrrr
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duck
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Post by duck on Oct 12, 2020 4:22:40 GMT
Never fear it will improve, Mike Coupe ex boss of Sainsbury's is now in charge of testing. You may remember him as ' we're in the money' Mike. What the article doesn't say is that Mike Coupe in the past appointed Dido Harding as a director of Sainsburys (before she went to Talk Talk), looks like a bit of back scratching going on.
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benaj
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Post by benaj on Oct 12, 2020 5:45:57 GMT
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Post by bracknellboy on Oct 12, 2020 6:57:06 GMT
I must admit my view does fluctuate a fair bit but one constant is a dislike of the scientific community presenting evidence and projections as close to fact. I also very much dislike a lot of what the government is doing/has done but the bottom line is if your scientists tell you X thousand people might die if you don't do Y then they have to do it.Somebody, some adult in the room, needs to really attempt to consider all this in the round. They need to weigh up not just economic costs but also other deaths, lack of health, eduction, social stress, mental health etc etc vs deaths from covid. They also need stop presenting figures in a certain way to support their policies. Of course the scientists focus 100% on direct deaths from covd but someone, i.e. the government should be able to see the full picture. .. michaelc : I struggle with this post. It seems to contain its own self-contradictions.
The "adult in the room" has to be the politicians (sadly, given our current bunch)
Firstly, I'm sure the 'scientists' are not presenting "hard facts". They will be presenting a set of scenarios. Secondly, we know - because they have said so directly - - that the collateral damage in the form of missed opportunities to treat other diseases, mental health, education etc. etc. are very much in their mind. They have said so publicly, and with so many different domains represented at SAGE then it will be so.
It is not the scientists 'policies'. All they can do is give best guess of outcomes of the varying mitigating steps that can be taken.
The adult in the room as you put it that has to consider everything in the round, especially the economic damage, because that is very much their balliwick, is the political body. It cannot and shouldn't be any other way. It is the political body that has to weigh up 'in the round' and make the decisions [edit] as to their policies (based on the information and views they have considered).
You seem to be suggesting that you would prefer it if the 'scientists' watered down their message so as to either make it easier for the politicians, or to in essence be making the decision for them by not presenting them with their true views.
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benaj
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Post by benaj on Oct 12, 2020 6:59:58 GMT
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Oct 12, 2020 8:03:34 GMT
I've been suggesting this for some time. There is too much faith in a vaccine completely sorting things out. It's not just the efficacy, it's the logistics. Of course the coming vaccinations will likely help significantly, but you need a sustainable policy while you wait and alongside a vaccine. And you need honesty about what you are trying to achieve, what you can realistically achieve, and the trade-offs you are explicitly making. Did someone mention grown-ups in the room? When did we last have them?
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Post by bracknellboy on Oct 12, 2020 8:15:17 GMT
I learnt a new word today: recrudescence
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benaj
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Post by benaj on Oct 12, 2020 9:01:03 GMT
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Oct 12, 2020 9:59:27 GMT
No doubt these are the same people that will complain bitterly when London gets locked down.
Bit like the story on the BBC website yesterday. Students that are having to isolate because they didn't follow social distancing are complaining about the quality of meals that are being delivered to them.
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