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Post by dan1 on Mar 14, 2020 21:54:36 GMT
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Post by moonraker on Mar 14, 2020 22:01:01 GMT
I can't believe this breaking story:
Surely unworkable, with a large army of volunteers needed to look after us. How long before some (including me) went "stir crazy" ("Acutely anxious, restless, irritable, irrational, and/or depressed from remaining for too long in an unstimulating, confined, and/or isolated environment. 'Stir' in this usage is a slang word for prison").
I live on my own in a house with garden, but imagine a couple spending four months in a tiny flat on the 12th floor of a block. How long before rows and worse broke out?
I would guess that most of us older people are already taking enough precautions, compared with young people who believe that if they do catch the virus they'll suffer little more than a cold.
I'm hoping that when I turn on the news in the morning there'll be a Government denial.
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travolta
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Post by travolta on Mar 14, 2020 22:20:22 GMT
I bloody well wont do it and thats flat.
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Post by dan1 on Mar 14, 2020 22:28:43 GMT
I can't believe this breaking story:
Surely unworkable, with a large army of volunteers needed to look after us. How long before some (including me) went "stir crazy" ("Acutely anxious, restless, irritable, irrational, and/or depressed from remaining for too long in an unstimulating, confined, and/or isolated environment. 'Stir' in this usage is a slang word for prison").
I live on my own in a house with garden, but imagine a couple spending four months in a tiny flat on the 12th floor of a block. How long before rows and worse broke out?
I would guess that most of us older people are already taking enough precautions, compared with young people who believe that if they do catch the virus they'll suffer little more than a cold.
I'm hoping that when I turn on the news in the morning there'll be a Government denial.
Further details in an article by ITV's political editor Robert Peson: www.spectator.co.uk/article/uk-quarantines-elderly-as-over-70s-told-stay-at-homeNote that Peston has previously been 'stung' by leaks from spads, notably over the false hospital punch tweets during the election campaign... www.pressgazette.co.uk/bbc-and-itv-political-editors-apologise-for-false-hospital-punch-claim-in-tweets/I note this because I wonder if this is a case of managing the govt comms. Prepare for something really really draconian yet deliver something far less draconian.
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djay
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Post by djay on Mar 14, 2020 22:42:16 GMT
I can't believe this breaking story:
Surely unworkable, with a large army of volunteers needed to look after us. How long before some (including me) went "stir crazy" ("Acutely anxious, restless, irritable, irrational, and/or depressed from remaining for too long in an unstimulating, confined, and/or isolated environment. 'Stir' in this usage is a slang word for prison").
I live on my own in a house with garden, but imagine a couple spending four months in a tiny flat on the 12th floor of a block. How long before rows and worse broke out?
I would guess that most of us older people are already taking enough precautions, compared with young people who believe that if they do catch the virus they'll suffer little more than a cold.
I'm hoping that when I turn on the news in the morning there'll be a Government denial.
Looked in again, not sure it's quite as draconian as suggested but the whole point of the strategy is the protect the most vulnerable groups rather than try to do the whole population as Italy have attempted and Spain are trying. The horse has bolted, European (inc UK) countries are seeded throughout, it's not focal points as seen in China, and South Korea. This will ride through most countries and will hit again in second and third waves unless there is sufficient herd immunity. The risk of it becoming endemic world wide is also a real threat, but much more research on the virus is needed to understand this risk. At the moment the best bet is to protect the vulnerable, isolate them from danger and allow continued protection via herd Immunity. I have set up weekly supermarket deliveries in advance for my elderly parents and the in laws in anticipation of this.
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Post by mrclondon on Mar 14, 2020 23:16:24 GMT
How many weeks worth of food are people stockpiling and how ? I generally have a few weeks of non-perishables in stock anyway, but that is simply a function of living in inner London and using public transport 9 times out of 10 when going out ... so I normally pick up fresh food on foot en-route back from the tube station, and only do a shop with my car every few weeks. I did however buy extra pasta when Italy started to become an issue, and extra coffee when I saw gaps on the shelves (as noted earlier in the thread, caffeine withdrawal is not something to take lightly).
There are several issues here I think.
- Some things may simply become unobtainable where sourced from a single country (e.g. pasta).
- Some things may be in short supply through panic buying but should be readily replacable in the UK (e.g. bread) - Some people will be on mandatory quarantine - Some people may want to reduce the frequency of shopping regardless - Some people may not have access to online grocery shopping, which may in any case may be out of stock of requested items (and no substitution made), and may have excessive lead times for delivery slots.
Being in inner London I have at least one (and in some cases two) of just about every supermarket brand within a 1.5 mile radius, but I really don't want to be searching multiple shops for items as that just increases the risk of exposure. My last visit to a supermarket was c. 8pm Wed evening .... and there was no bread of any description. Absolutely not normal. But not a problem as I have plenty in the freezer ... along with c. 2 weeks supply of meat.
Which leads to a dilema that I have been pondering today .... is it worth shelling out £120 on a (medium sized) freezer for the garage. Essentially is there going to be a benefit in a) stocking up on say bread when I can find it and b) using more frozen veg rather than fresh to minimize visits to supermarkets. Is the crisis going to last long enough for it to be worthwhile ?
Biggest issue for me is probably fresh fruit & veg ... not a problem in winter as the utility room is unheated and north facing and fruit keeps quite nicely stored in there, but summer in London is a very different picture.
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iRobot
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Post by iRobot on Mar 14, 2020 23:28:10 GMT
is it worth shelling out £120 on a (medium sized) freezer for the garage. Essentially is there going to be a benefit in ... 120-quid seems a pretty low premium for a not-insignificant slice of 'peace-of-mind'. I'd do it if I hadn't already (a few years ago and for wholly different reasons).
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Post by mrclondon on Mar 14, 2020 23:30:49 GMT
is it worth shelling out £120 on a (medium sized) freezer for the garage. Essentially is there going to be a benefit in ... 120-quid seems a pretty low premium for a not-insignificant slice of 'peace-of-mind'. I'd do it if I hadn't already (a few years ago and for wholly different reasons). Agreed ... its more the nightmare of making room for it in the garage !
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Mar 14, 2020 23:53:19 GMT
Plenty of bread today in my local Sainsbury's. Not an egg to be found though. Go figure.
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Post by mrclondon on Mar 14, 2020 23:55:28 GMT
Whilst the "herd immunity" strategy resonates with me, looking at the speed events are moving in Spain, France & Germany and the measures they are implementing primarily to protect their health services from overload rather than contain the spread, I suspect many more restrictive measures are on the way for the UK, and not that far in the future. Or put another way, the speed of spread throughout Europe (incl Scandanavia) over recent days means that irrespective of official strategy, the European herd are catching it regardless. There will be no stopping this now. (Also worth noting its pleasantly warm in large parts of Italy and Spain).
Turning back to economic issues, I think the shutdowns across the world announced over the last 24-36 hours in particular as well as the tightening of national borders is cause for alarm. These are not short term measures (even if announced as applying for the next n days). This is a total up ending of the world as we know it (probably no exageration to say since the end of WWII). The economic shock is going to be profound. For countries to be mandating the closure of all restaurants/bar/cafes and non food/pharmacy retail is going to force a huge number of small service/retail operators to the brink of banckruptcy .... and that is before considering the bigger chains (e.g. fashion and department stores) that were already struggling. To assume that the only lasting damage will be to travel/leisure/hospitality companies is I feel shortsighted. To give just one example - if the big DIY sheds are forced to close, there is no demand for the products they offer, a high proportion of which are manufactured in the UK ... which impacts on manufacturer's and their staff.
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Post by pepperpot on Mar 15, 2020 4:59:52 GMT
Thinking only of oneself will not help. Making sure one has enough 'stock' will increase the risk of looting of said stock in an increasingly stressed society. Groceries are set up with an 'on demand' supply chain. The chain can still work but it's being stretched due to fear. If it truly breaks, so will social cohesion. Nine Meals from AnarchyHerd mentality may be required before we reach herd immunity. #Blitzspirit |
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cb25
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Post by cb25 on Mar 15, 2020 9:20:17 GMT
I can't believe this breaking story:
Surely unworkable, with a large army of volunteers needed to look after us. How long before some (including me) went "stir crazy" ("Acutely anxious, restless, irritable, irrational, and/or depressed from remaining for too long in an unstimulating, confined, and/or isolated environment. 'Stir' in this usage is a slang word for prison").
I live on my own in a house with garden, but imagine a couple spending four months in a tiny flat on the 12th floor of a block. How long before rows and worse broke out?
I would guess that most of us older people are already taking enough precautions, compared with young people who believe that if they do catch the virus they'll suffer little more than a cold.
I'm hoping that when I turn on the news in the morning there'll be a Government denial.
Similar article on the BBC
"Action to isolate the UK's over-70s for an extended period to shield them from coronavirus is planned in the coming weeks, Health Secretary Matt Hancock has confirmed. He told Sky News the measure "is a very big ask of the elderly and vulnerable, but it is for their own protection".
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The self-isolation measure would mean people being asked to remain at home without visitors and with vital supplies dropped off for them on their doorsteps.
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Speaking to Sky News' Sophy Ridge, Mr Hancock was asked if the advice would be in place for four months as has been reported. He said: "We'll be setting it out with more detail when it is the right time to do so." But he added the reason the measure has not been implemented yet is the length of time required is "very long""
Also now reported in the Telegraph "People aged over 70 will be asked in the coming weeks to self-isolate for up to four months in order to protect them from the coronavirus, Health Secretary Matt Hancock says."
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Mar 15, 2020 9:24:45 GMT
Agreed ... its more the nightmare of making room for it in the garage ! And then there’s the opportunity cost. Sticking first with easy round numbers £1000 per sq ft is not untypical for the cost of property in London. At a yield of 5% that’s equivalent to £50 per annum per sq ft. Ok it’s your garage, and £1000 might be on the high side and 5% yield might be also a bit high but equally what has been an appreciating asset or at least holding its value might be heading for some fall. I think the true lifetime cost is probably a multiple of £120 - double it for the cost of carry (sq ft rental) plus add in the labour of bringing it in and one day disposing of it (at least in labour terms but preferably in environmental costs too!). Is it still a no-brainer? For us a big freezer is extremely useful and cost effective. You can usually find free delivery when you buy one and if you have to replace it you can usually get free or cheap disposal of the old one at the same time. You also save by not wasting as much food (leftovers can be frozen for another day) and taking advantage of BOGOFs and special offers as you can put the extras in the freezer. We also grow quite a bit of fruit and veg, and freeze the excess.
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Mar 15, 2020 10:49:34 GMT
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Post by bernythedolt on Mar 15, 2020 10:50:30 GMT
Do I have a significant quantities of loo roll, tinned fish, etc.? Yes, but not because I have gone out and stockpiled for Coronavirus. Any large quantities I have of long use by items will have been where there has been no inconvenience to me of delivery (either I have had an incentivised online delivery or it’s a rare occasion I’ve taken the car to the grocery shop) but most importantly in this 0.5% interest era if someone is offering me 20% off an item it’s the best risk-reward-return I’ll get on my capital by forward buying supplies I’ll use well within the use by date and well within any hurdle rate return, all constrained by not going beyond the point of near zero marginal cost of storage. Wow - leaving your waitress 10% tip must feel like having teeth pulled! 
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