registerme
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Post by registerme on Dec 12, 2021 11:19:51 GMT
The first people in the UK have been hospitalised with Omicron infections. Shame the article doesn't say if they were vaccinated or not
Perhaps the most concerning/surprising bit in there is that "The new variant of coronavirus now accounts for a third of cases in London, the education secretary said." how long ago since we heard about it ? 2 weeks ? 3 weeks ? Given that I was double jabbed (AZ) I'd be surprised if I haven't got Omicron. I'd still like to know where I caught it though. Options are:- 1. Delivering some shopping to some friends who had COVID and needed to isolate - I stayed on the pavement ten feet away from their front door. 2. My local coffee shop, where I'd taken to wearing a mask whilst picking up my coffee (not 100% though if I am honest). One of the ladies who worked there had a cough the last time I went in... 3. The pub last Saturday, where I went to get a takeout pizza. I didn't wear a mask, and it was busier than usual. 4. Sainsburys etc. Where I always wear a mask. 5. The street. Where I don't wear a mask. I think I'm plumping for #2 at the moment, but it's hard to be certain. I'm no paragon of virtue but I think I normally do a reasonable job of trying to be sensible / adhere to the rules. Ho hum. The thing I am most annoyed about is missing my booster slot. Oh, and the washing machine (tried calling, waited on hold for 40mins and gave up, have emailed, no response).
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Dec 12, 2021 11:21:37 GMT
The first people in the UK have been hospitalised with Omicron infections. Shame the article doesn't say if they were vaccinated or not
Perhaps the most concerning/surprising bit in there is that "The new variant of coronavirus now accounts for a third of cases in London, the education secretary said." how long ago since we heard about it ? 2 weeks ? 3 weeks ? But this is more of the vague waffle that you get from the media:
- How many Omicron cases are there in London
- How many of them have been hospitalised
- How many of the hospitalised people were vaccinated
- How many of the hospitalised people have pre-existing medical conditions
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p2pmark
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Post by p2pmark on Dec 12, 2021 11:29:54 GMT
Slightly better off than without any vacc at all... Possibly. I think I read the efficacy against o is about 5%. 2 years ago or thereabouts I seem to recall reading that (the CDC ?) said an efficacy of 50% is realistically needed to combat the virus. 5% seems way below that and would seem particularly problematic given its rareish serious and fatal side affects. This leads me on to starting to get annoyed at the vaccine debate. I've said many times I've had 2 azn vaccines and am due my 3rd shot of Pfizer soon. However, I'm becoming more and more alienated from the "vaccine is good, anti-vaxxers are bad" debate. In hindsight there were and are clear risks from taking any of the vaccines. The scientists media should have have been 100% honest about what they know and not try to influence (vaccine update) in any way. Another example was the way all three uk authorised vaccines were treated. "THE vaccine" was a phrase frequently used despite the fact that there were three with one being very different to the other two. It was done to influence people not worry about which vaccine they received. Pages ago on this thread I moaned about my AZN vaccine and most would accept now that it frankly is inferior. At the risk of adding to your annoyance re: propaganda, do bear in mind that 2xAZN is expected to be more than 50% effective in preventing serious disease. And 2xAZN+1Pfizer is also much better than just 1 Pfizer in terms of preventing even just symptomatic disease so even with Omicron there are still significant benefits even now in having had the 2xAZN. (Plus the benefit from non-Omicron variants which may still circulate for somet time.)
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Dec 12, 2021 11:32:34 GMT
The first people in the UK have been hospitalised with Omicron infections. Shame the article doesn't say if they were vaccinated or not
Or what age they are. There are reports that children too young to be vaccinated (in the UK anyway) are getting seriously ill from this variant. I think this was reported in SA, can't find the quote off hand. Found this, not what I originally saw: www.thesun.co.uk/health/16928813/new-fears-kids-greater-risk-omicron-hospitalisations/
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benaj
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Post by benaj on Dec 12, 2021 11:40:06 GMT
Perhaps the most concerning/surprising bit in there is that "The new variant of coronavirus now accounts for a third of cases in London, the education secretary said." how long ago since we heard about it ? 2 weeks ? 3 weeks ? Given that I was double jabbed (AZ) I'd be surprised if I haven't got Omicron. I'd still like to know where I caught it though. Options are:- 1. Delivering some shopping to some friends who had COVID and needed to isolate - I stayed on the pavement ten feet away from their front door. 2. My local coffee shop, where I'd taken to wearing a mask whilst picking up my coffee (not 100% though if I am honest). One of the ladies who worked there had a cough the last time I went in... 3. The pub last Saturday, where I went to get a takeout pizza. I didn't wear a mask, and it was busier than usual. 4. Sainsburys etc. Where I always wear a mask. 5. The street. Where I don't wear a mask. I think I'm plumping for #2 at the moment, but it's hard to be certain. I'm no paragon of virtue but I think I normally do a reasonable job of trying to be sensible / adhere to the rules. Ho hum. The thing I am most annoyed about is missing my booster slot. Oh, and the washing machine (tried calling, waited on hold for 40mins and gave up, have emailed, no response). Maybe it’s time to think about good fortune. Given the fact someone caught omicron without leaving the room of the quarantine hotel and hasn’t yet ended up in the hospital, catching the real thing by chance might be the best “booster” for the vaccinated. fortune.com/2021/12/06/omicron-hong-kong-hotel-hallway-spreadBy the time you get your booster jab, you will be “ super immune” even if you didn’t catch the real thing last year. 😅
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Dec 12, 2021 12:29:12 GMT
I'd still like to know where I caught it though. Options are:- 2. My local coffee shop, where I'd taken to wearing a mask whilst picking up my coffee (not 100% though if I am honest). One of the ladies who worked there had a cough the last time I went in... 3. The pub last Saturday, where I went to get a takeout pizza. I didn't wear a mask, and it was busier than usual. These two have to be favourites. What happened to track'n'trace, eh? Such good value...
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Dec 12, 2021 12:43:47 GMT
Maybe it’s time to think about good fortune. Given the fact someone caught omicron without leaving the room of the quarantine hotel and hasn’t yet ended up in the hospital, catching the real thing by chance might be the best “booster” for the vaccinated. fortune.com/2021/12/06/omicron-hong-kong-hotel-hallway-spreadBy the time you get your booster jab, you will be “ super immune” even if you didn’t catch the real thing last year. 😅 That's not what the article says. There are other possible ways of infection stated.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Dec 12, 2021 13:15:13 GMT
Maybe it’s time to think about good fortune. Given the fact someone caught omicron without leaving the room of the quarantine hotel and hasn’t yet ended up in the hospital, catching the real thing by chance might be the best “booster” for the vaccinated. fortune.com/2021/12/06/omicron-hong-kong-hotel-hallway-spreadBy the time you get your booster jab, you will be “ super immune” even if you didn’t catch the real thing last year. 😅 That's not what the article says. There are other possible ways of infection stated. Actual case study... wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/28/2/21-2422_articleBoth double-pfiz'd, c.5-6mo beforehand. A arrived from SA on 11th, tested +ve on 13th, asymptomatic. B arrived from Canada on 10th, showed symptoms on 17th, tested +ve on 18th. No mention of whether the hotel aircon system may be the vector, rather than breathing across the corridor while doors were open... None of the staff or other people on the floor tested +ve.
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benaj
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Post by benaj on Dec 12, 2021 15:05:57 GMT
www.gov.uk/government/news/daily-rapid-testing-for-covid-19-contacts-launches-this-weekFrom Tuesday, , fully vaccinated contacts of a COVID-19 case should take a daily lateral flow test for 7 days to slow the spread of the virus. “Unvaccinated adults” are not eligible for this new daily testing policy, they “must” self-isolate for 10 days if they are a contact of someone who tests positive for COVID-19 – Omicron or not – unless eligible for an existing workplace daily contact testing. 🙄 Under 5s are exempt from self-isolation and do not need to take part in daily rapid lateral flow testing.
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Dec 12, 2021 15:06:00 GMT
Possibly. I think I read the efficacy against o is about 5%. 2 years ago or thereabouts I seem to recall reading that (the CDC ?) said an efficacy of 50% is realistically needed to combat the virus. 5% seems way below that and would seem particularly problematic given its rareish serious and fatal side affects. This leads me on to starting to get annoyed at the vaccine debate. I've said many times I've had 2 azn vaccines and am due my 3rd shot of Pfizer soon. However, I'm becoming more and more alienated from the "vaccine is good, anti-vaxxers are bad" debate. In hindsight there were and are clear risks from taking any of the vaccines. The scientists media should have have been 100% honest about what they know and not try to influence (vaccine update) in any way. Another example was the way all three uk authorised vaccines were treated. "THE vaccine" was a phrase frequently used despite the fact that there were three with one being very different to the other two. It was done to influence people not worry about which vaccine they received. Pages ago on this thread I moaned about my AZN vaccine and most would accept now that it frankly is inferior. At the risk of adding to your annoyance re: propaganda, do bear in mind that 2xAZN is expected to be more than 50% effective in preventing serious disease. And 2xAZN+1Pfizer is also much better than just 1 Pfizer in terms of preventing even just symptomatic disease so even with Omicron there are still significant benefits even now in having had the 2xAZN. (Plus the benefit from non-Omicron variants which may still circulate for somet time.) Possibly and I assume it depends on the timings. Also after having all three how well protected are we 6 months on? Slightly separately, registerme 's point about being glad to have had it is a good one. Particuarly with pre-omicron variants. I also credit it to helping me not catch it from my family despite sharing a medium sized flat so personally speaking I'm also very glad. However, notwithstanding Mark's point which I haven't checked, the 2xAZN has helped my for the past 7 months but doubt its going to do much going forwards. I stand by my point about propoganda. Oh and in case I wasn't very clear before, I'm very glad indeed that RM seems to be getting over it well. Good stuff !
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Post by bracknellboy on Dec 12, 2021 15:14:23 GMT
Perhaps the most concerning/surprising bit in there is that "The new variant of coronavirus now accounts for a third of cases in London, the education secretary said." how long ago since we heard about it ? 2 weeks ? 3 weeks ? But this is more of the vague waffle that you get from the media:
- How many Omicron cases are there in London
- How many of them have been hospitalised
- How many of the hospitalised people were vaccinated
- How many of the hospitalised people have pre-existing medical conditions
well its not "vague waffle from the media" is it ? They have simply reported that a minister has said: in toto, no more and no less. They have not stated it as their opinion, their fact or anything else. Just that person a said b. What would you rather they do: not report what a minister of the govt has said ? If there is waffle, then it can only be on the part of the minister.
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benaj
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Post by benaj on Dec 12, 2021 15:35:47 GMT
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michaelc
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Say No To T.D.S.
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Post by michaelc on Dec 12, 2021 15:56:49 GMT
But this is more of the vague waffle that you get from the media:
- How many Omicron cases are there in London
- How many of them have been hospitalised
- How many of the hospitalised people were vaccinated
- How many of the hospitalised people have pre-existing medical conditions
well its not "vague waffle from the media" is it ? They have simply reported that a minister has said: in toto, no more and no less. They have not stated it as their opinion, their fact or anything else. Just that person a said b. What would you rather they do: not report what a minister of the govt has said ? If there is waffle, then it can only be on the part of the minister. They could chose to interview a couple scientists and get quotes from them about the situation. The minister for example, said "I can now confirm there are hospitalised cases of omicron....". They could chose to ask how many cases, how many in ICU and how many on Oxygen. But no, they leave it at that in order to worry people into having their booster. I'd rather get the truth from say the bbc and not be forced into finding scientists and medics who I consider reasonably unbiased (e.g. www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2vI4XczqZ8 )
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p2pmark
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Post by p2pmark on Dec 12, 2021 16:09:52 GMT
At the risk of adding to your annoyance re: propaganda, do bear in mind that 2xAZN is expected to be more than 50% effective in preventing serious disease. And 2xAZN+1Pfizer is also much better than just 1 Pfizer in terms of preventing even just symptomatic disease so even with Omicron there are still significant benefits even now in having had the 2xAZN. (Plus the benefit from non-Omicron variants which may still circulate for somet time.) Possibly and I assume it depends on the timings. Also after having all three how well protected are we 6 months on? Slightly separately, registerme 's point about being glad to have had it is a good one. Particuarly with pre-omicron variants. I also credit it to helping me not catch it from my family despite sharing a medium sized flat so personally speaking I'm also very glad. However, notwithstanding Mark's point which I haven't checked, the 2xAZN has helped my for the past 7 months but doubt its going to do much going forwards. I stand by my point about propoganda. Oh and in case I wasn't very clear before, I'm very glad indeed that RM seems to be getting over it well. Good stuff ! You may be interested in this, especially Figure 7.
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r00lish67
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Post by r00lish67 on Dec 12, 2021 16:20:00 GMT
well its not "vague waffle from the media" is it ? They have simply reported that a minister has said: in toto, no more and no less. They have not stated it as their opinion, their fact or anything else. Just that person a said b. What would you rather they do: not report what a minister of the govt has said ? If there is waffle, then it can only be on the part of the minister. They could chose to interview a couple scientists and get quotes from them about the situation. The minister for example, said "I can now confirm there are hospitalised cases of omicron....". They could chose to ask how many cases, how many in ICU and how many on Oxygen. But no, they leave it at that in order to worry people into having their booster. I'd rather get the truth from say the bbc and not be forced into finding scientists and medics who I consider reasonably unbiased (e.g. www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2vI4XczqZ8 ) Hi all, thought I'd drop by to see what the chat is here about all of this. Firstly, I don't always agree with Michael, but I came here to say something similar. Reading the front page of BBC news this morning (morning where I am), I felt somewhat propagandised towards (is that a word?). It felt far too much to me like a public health service announcement than the actual truth. I appreciate it's probably with good intent at heart (get a booster everyone), but it does make a mockery of the 'news'. Anyway... I think the Govt are a bit screwed with this aren't they? They have what appears to be a mild/very mild variant which is super-transmissive/evasive. They have zero time to sit back and analyse it, and have to decide basically now whether to impose even more restrictions. There's a small chance of a big catastrophe if for some reason the data from SA is misleading (e.g. maybe their beta immunity protected them more?), so probably the right thing to do is to be cautious and put in more restrictions. However, if they do that, and (more than likely) it proves to be as mild as in SA then that's fuel to the fire for all the anti-vaxxers and a general feeling of "well that was a waste of time - thanks!" from everyone else. If they don't do that however then it might work out alright, but if the variant is even slightly less mild than SA it could still amount to overwhelming the NHS. Tough gig. Knowing this Govt, they'll probably just go with some fudgey wish-washy "you shouldn't not perhaps consider going out but the pubs will stay open and you shouldn't be in them" sort of thing. Frankly though, as per Registerme's recent experience (hope you're ok), this thing seems so bloody transmissive that I'm not sure even the most stringent measures they'd consider would do an awful lot. Meanwhile, I'm in Mexico double-pfized and not planning on leaving, so I have all of my fingers and toes crossed that what is coming out of SA is comparable for everybody.
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