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Post by captainconfident on Jun 23, 2023 18:19:15 GMT
As if hindrance or the lack of to tourist traffic is the only place to look for "Brexit friction". Ouch, cheap shot - I'm on holiday, so you get that one for free! As you know, I was addressing michaelc 's specific comment concerning the "friction" of frequent travelling to Europe, which doesn't match my own personal experience, hence my question to him. Oh, sorry! I should have read along more carefully. Now, if you a) Think Labour will win the next election and b) Halve a spare half hour and c) can look past this paper being prepared by the Tony Blair Institute, Then I recommend this long report. The Labour says that we will not be rejoining the SM and CU. So what will they do? This report lists ten things they are very likely to do during the next parliament, on top of the phyto-sanitary agreement. It's worth looking a these - none of the ten things is much to object to in itself. Having failed to conclude any meaningful trade deals, the UK has noting to lose and a lot to gain from voluntary alignment with EU rules. Inevitable under one or two terms of a Labour government, while we won't rejoin the SM, we will end up shadowing it in return for better access. www.institute.global/insights/geopolitics-and-security/moving-forward-path-to-better-post-brexit-relationship-between-uk-eu
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Jun 23, 2023 19:51:07 GMT
When flying to poland or slavakia I always get asked "what is the purpose of your visit" and sometimes a few follow on questions. Then a rummage around in my passport followed by a stamp. Driving out of Ukraine into Poland just before the war, it took around 3 hours for EU citizens and 8 hours for everyone else. When I went, after waiting for 8 hours I got to the end of the line only to be told by the polish guard, "UK....you need to join the EU queue" (!!!). THankfully that was the final queue at the end of quite an ordeal so only another hour or so to wait. Of course if I did that again I'd have no idea which queue to join. From memory many airports in Europe also have faster EU only queues although the differences are nowhere near as stark as at the land borders with Ukraine! Poland/Slovakia - quite trivial matters then. Ukraine border - exodus hardly representative of general European travel, to be fair, in the build up to a war. Oh it was before then - sorry my fault for not saying when but from memory about 6-9 months before. Land borders out of Ukraine have been horrendous for donkeys years. I was just highlighting the loss of a "VIP channel" there aka the "EU channel".
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Jun 26, 2023 10:15:27 GMT
It's worth looking a these - none of the ten things is much to object to in itself. ...unless you agree with May's October 2016 conference "red line" on ECJ involvement...
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Post by captainconfident on Jun 28, 2023 10:32:52 GMT
Ouch, cheap shot - I'm on holiday, so you get that one for free! As you know, I was addressing michaelc 's specific comment concerning the "friction" of frequent travelling to Europe, which doesn't match my own personal experience, hence my question to him. Oh, sorry! I should have read along more carefully. Now, if you a) Think Labour will win the next election and b) Halve a spare half hour and c) can look past this paper being prepared by the Tony Blair Institute, Then I recommend this long report. The Labour says that we will not be rejoining the SM and CU. So what will they do? This report lists ten things they are very likely to do during the next parliament, on top of the phyto-sanitary agreement. It's worth looking a these - none of the ten things is much to object to in itself. Having failed to conclude any meaningful trade deals, the UK has noting to lose and a lot to gain from voluntary alignment with EU rules. Inevitable under one or two terms of a Labour government, while we won't rejoin the SM, we will end up shadowing it in return for better access. www.institute.global/insights/geopolitics-and-security/moving-forward-path-to-better-post-brexit-relationship-between-uk-euThe Economist makes the following comment on this report:- "The biggest obstacle lies in persuading the eu to agree to any such ideas. At the meeting of the eu-uk forum, Maros Sefcovic of the European Commission suggested that trade barriers were likely to get worse not better, and saw little hope for big changes during a five-year review of the tca that is due in 2025-26. The commission thinks the review should be about implementing the 2021 deal, not expanding it. The eu likes the existing arrangement, as it helps goods exports but does little for services, Britain’s strength. It is also wary of a non-member cherry-picking the benefits of its single market without signing up to associated obligations.
There are two political lessons to draw from Brexit disillusion. One: it is no longer possible for the Tories to persuade voters who backed them in 2019 not to switch to Labour for fear of losing the advantages of Brexit—for these are so difficult to discern. The other: whoever wins the next election, the trend will be towards closer relations with the eu, not moving further away. The process may take longer than anti-Brexiteers hope, and it will always be a mistake to take eu assent to future changes for granted. Yet Brussels and national capitals will surely feel under pressure to be nicer to Britain, especially if Labour wins. The eventual destination is still uncertain; but the direction of travel now looks settled."
The Economist 'As Britons grow more unhappy with Brexit, what happens next?' - 27/6/23
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Jun 28, 2023 12:10:26 GMT
The commission ... is also wary of a non-member cherry-picking the benefits of its single market without signing up to associated obligations. Well, yep. That got repeatedly shouted down as "project fear"... The four freedoms are still inseparable from the EU perspective, unchanged as they are from the 1957 Treaty of Rome, four years before the first of the UK's three attempts to join the EEC...
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Sept 16, 2023 10:13:19 GMT
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Post by bernythedolt on Sept 16, 2023 10:53:04 GMT
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Sept 16, 2023 11:29:19 GMT
My uncle lived in Brussels and worked for the EU for most of his life. He "helped" my brother get a job there who since moved to the euro parliament and now also retired recently (early). Some years ago, my uncle told me that the EU had to give their staff pay and conditions at least as good as the top ranking civil service of any member state. But this applied individually to each area of human resources. Otherwise, the theory was, it would disadvantage and not attract staff from countries with a more generous scheme. Therefore, this ended up with a hybrid scheme picking the very best and most generous conditions in each area (pay, holiday and so on). Thus when compared to government civil services across all member states, the EU staff had the highest pay, the longest holidays, the most generous travel policy (uncle very quickly racked up several airlines gold cards), access to the best independent schools etc. This was one of the reasons I voted as I did.
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Oct 13, 2023 9:56:38 GMT
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toffeeboy
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Post by toffeeboy on Oct 19, 2023 10:02:18 GMT
Just back from Spain, did had to laugh upon arriving. My partner is Irish so she went through he EU queue and I went through the non-EU with my UK passport, I got through no problem and got my stamp then had to wait five minutes for her to get through her side. so much for brexit slowing done getting in to a country Been to a few countries now and most don't even have a separate queue for EU/non-EU travellers
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benaj
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Post by benaj on Oct 19, 2023 10:12:41 GMT
Just back from Spain, did had to laugh upon arriving. My partner is Irish so she went through he EU queue and I went through the non-EU with my UK passport, I got through no problem and got my stamp then had to wait five minutes for her to get through her side. so much for brexit slowing done getting in to a country Been to a few countries now and most don't even have a separate queue for EU/non-EU travellers Whenever I travel with family, we go through the same queue despite different nationality. Since, the brexit I went through the EU queue, it’s definitely longer. I start to wonder should I just take everyone to the non eu queue instead. Especially when coming back to the Uk, the eu / uk / biometric queue is definitely a lot longer! Compared to 20/30 years ago, coming back to the UK with british passport is almost just a walk without waiting
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Post by captainconfident on Oct 19, 2023 11:05:17 GMT
If the only effect of Brexit was to separate passport checks into two queues, then it's been a complete success.
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Oct 19, 2023 13:18:15 GMT
If the rapprochement continues I suspect there is every chance we'll see "EU/UK" one way, and Other Passports the other in most EU countries or all if its part of a deal.
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keitha
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Post by keitha on Oct 26, 2023 16:55:52 GMT
If the only effect of Brexit was to separate passport checks into two queues, then it's been a complete success. one queue for eurostar at both ends, have to say both Belgian and British Officials much more polite than the French
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Nov 11, 2023 10:13:04 GMT
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