adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Jan 9, 2024 13:18:30 GMT
Is the concept of advertising new to you? Aah your usual childish deflection tactic  You were not referring to advertising "in general" but specifically to the great claims of Smart meters which were neither misleading nor inaccurate. I was merely pointing out that this was not the case. The claims they're making aren't inaccurate or misleading, as you overthehill suggested when you they said they should be reported to the ASA. Their claims appear to tick both your boxes of "honest" and "upfront". They're careful - following previous ASA slap-downs - to say that you won't save money merely by having one, but they can open the door to saving through other tariffs or time-shifting loads or simply being aware. Your beef is completely separate - a different company (who also advertise similarly that you can save money via a smart meter) can't get yours to work. But, of course, if you couldn't save money through having one, would that even matter...?
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jonno
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Post by jonno on Jan 9, 2024 13:20:10 GMT
No, but they are incomplete. There should be another one which says "Don't assume that because you've had a Smart Meter fitted, it will actually work" I had mine fitted 16 months ago by EDF and the gas side has never worked. Had a phone call this morning to arrange fourth engineer visit Interesting. Is that meaning that the gas meter smart capability doesn't work - you are having to send manual readings - or simply that it is not sending data to the IHD ? The former. As for the IHD, (obviously for electricity only) it's also hit and miss and has to be placed in a far corner of the room to give it any chance of picking up a signal.
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jonno
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Post by jonno on Jan 9, 2024 13:28:23 GMT
Aah your usual childish deflection tactic You were not referring to advertising "in general" but specifically to the great claims of Smart meters which were neither misleading nor inaccurate. I was merely pointing out that this was not the case. The claims they're making aren't inaccurate or misleading, as you suggested when you said they should be reported to the ASA. Their claims appear to tick both your boxes of "honest" and "upfront". They're careful - following previous ASA slap-downs - to say that you won't save money merely by having one, but they can open the door to saving through other tariffs or time-shifting loads or simply being aware. Your beef is completely separate - a different company (who also advertise similarly that you can save money via a smart meter) can't get yours to work. But, of course, if you couldn't save money through having one, would that even matter...? Erm.........can you enlighten me as to where I "suggested they should be reported to the ASA" please.
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Post by overthehill on Jan 9, 2024 13:31:57 GMT
Aah,sorry; I wasn't looking at it from an ASA complaint perspective, but rather merely being honest and upfront with people. What a naive, silly Billy I am  Is the concept of advertising new to you?
Most adverts should be banned just for cringeworthiness, borderline scamming, bare-faced celebrity / company based dishonesty or pure exploitation like with gambling ads.
But for anyone unconvinced, I can recommend this new type of heater which heats the whole room in seconds and uses a fraction of the electricity of a standard heater, the utility companies don't want people to know about them as they will lose money, as seen on youtube.
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jonno
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Post by jonno on Jan 9, 2024 13:39:31 GMT
Is the concept of advertising new to you?
Most adverts should be banned just for cringeworthiness, borderline scamming, bare-faced celebrity / company based dishonesty or pure exploitation like with gambling ads.
But for anyone unconvinced, I can recommend this new type of heater which heats the whole room in seconds and uses a fraction of the electricity of a standard heater, the utility companies don't want people to know about them as they will lose money, as seen on youtube.
SOLD!!! I'll take two 
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Jan 9, 2024 13:39:34 GMT
The claims they're making aren't inaccurate or misleading, as you suggested when you said they should be reported to the ASA. Their claims appear to tick both your boxes of "honest" and "upfront". They're careful - following previous ASA slap-downs - to say that you won't save money merely by having one, but they can open the door to saving through other tariffs or time-shifting loads or simply being aware. Your beef is completely separate - a different company (who also advertise similarly that you can save money via a smart meter) can't get yours to work. But, of course, if you couldn't save money through having one, would that even matter...? Erm.........can you enlighten me as to where I "suggested they should be reported to the ASA" please. My apologies, I was confusing you with OTH. I guess the the advertising standards authority doesn't have an issue !
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jonno
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Post by jonno on Jan 9, 2024 13:42:25 GMT
Erm.........can you enlighten me as to where I "suggested they should be reported to the ASA" please. My apologies, I was confusing you with OTH. I guess the the advertising standards authority doesn't have an issue ! I thank you. I'm definitely "Over the Hill" but I'm definitely not overthehill 
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keitha
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Post by keitha on Jan 9, 2024 14:52:06 GMT
No, but they are incomplete. There should be another one which says "Don't assume that because you've had a Smart Meter fitted, it will actually work" I had mine fitted 16 months ago by EDF and the gas side has never worked. Had a phone call this morning to arrange fourth engineer visit Interesting. Is that meaning that the gas meter smart capability doesn't work - you are having to send manual readings - or simply that it is not sending data to the IHD ? grr I'll explain again in simple terms as it seems people don't understand SMART METERSThe electricity meter powers the Comms Hub which sits in top of it the Comms Hub sends data to the DCC depending on where you are by radio signal or 2/3G ( ignoring the small number that use mesh ). The DCC sends the data on to your supplier. This is what is used for billing. The Electricity and gas meters send data to the Comms hub ( Electricity every few seconds, gas every 30 minutes ) the same readings can also be sent to your IHD, the gas and electricity meters do not send data to the IHD. ISSUES Most IHDs read tariffs and standing charge from the meter. this is often way out of date despite it being a common system there are multiple suppliers of comms hubs and meters. believe it or not the Government when it specified the meters etc did not specify file formats for data storage, so if the same file is sent to update different meters this is interpreted as different things for example lets say the standing charge is 52.67p if the supplier sends a file to the DCC to update the standing charge on 20,000 meters some will interpret 5267 as 5.267p some as 52.67 and others at £5267 ! ( this is where the my meter is charging me £10,000 a day headline comes from ), it's actually worse as different firmware on the same device stores data differently. manufacturers of Gas/Electricity meters and Comms hubs roll out changes without consulting the suppliers, one Comms hub "upgrade" took 100's of thousands of smart meters offline for months as it stopped then sending data to the DCC, yet the energy suppliers have to deal with the fallout The DCC network physically could not cope with updates to the meters on tariffs such as agile where the price changes every 30 minutes. I use mine to look at how much electricity I've used in kWh not £'s Most suppliers do not install meters it is sub contracted IHDs vary between good and totally useless, I like my GEO Trio A comms hub can only have 4 IHDs connected Real Life and smart metersI had smart meters installed in 2019 together with solar and a battery in 2020 I paid on average 5.8p kWh, 2021 8.8p, 2022 8.5p, 2023 19.2p I defy anyone to say they can beat that on price on a dumb meter. currently 7p kWh for gas is low, since I had a new smart meter installed in October I'm averaging 4.9p that's a saving of £61. Since 2020 I have used over 8000kWh of electricity, during that time my total bill is -£1,220, and yes you did read that right on average they are paying me £300 a year more than I pay them, part of the reason my cost per kWh went up in 2023 was they paid me silly money to export on average 24.9P. I would however agree that on their own smart meters do not save money, what saves money is changing behaviour, but I would say the majority of people stick on a single rate tariff and so don't save
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jonno
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Post by jonno on Jan 9, 2024 15:07:29 GMT
Interesting. Is that meaning that the gas meter smart capability doesn't work - you are having to send manual readings - or simply that it is not sending data to the IHD ? grr I'll explain again in simple terms as it seems people don't understand SMART METERSThe electricity meter powers the Comms Hub which sits in top of it the Comms Hub sends data to the DCC depending on where you are by radio signal or 2/3G ( ignoring the small number that use mesh ). The DCC sends the data on to your supplier. This is what is used for billing. The Electricity and gas meters send data to the Comms hub ( Electricity every few seconds, gas every 30 minutes ) the same readings can also be sent to your IHD, the gas and electricity meters do not send data to the IHD. ISSUES Most IHDs read tariffs and standing charge from the meter. this is often way out of date despite it being a common system there are multiple suppliers of comms hubs and meters. believe it or not the Government when it specified the meters etc did not specify file formats for data storage, so if the same file is sent to update different meters this is interpreted as different things for example lets say the standing charge is 52.67p if the supplier sends a file to the DCC to update the standing charge on 20,000 meters some will interpret 5267 as 5.267p some as 52.67 and others at £5267 ! ( this is where the my meter is charging me £10,000 a day headline comes from ), it's actually worse as different firmware on the same device stores data differently. manufacturers of Gas/Electricity meters and Comms hubs roll out changes without consulting the suppliers, one Comms hub "upgrade" took 100's of thousands of smart meters offline for months as it stopped then sending data to the DCC, yet the energy suppliers have to deal with the fallout The DCC network physically could not cope with updates to the meters on tariffs such as agile where the price changes every 30 minutes. I use mine to look at how much electricity I've used in kWh not £'s Most suppliers do not install meters it is sub contracted IHDs vary between good and totally useless, I like my GEO Trio A comms hub can only have 4 IHDs connected Real Life and smart metersI had smart meters installed in 2019 together with solar and a battery in 2020 I paid on average 5.8p kWh, 2021 8.8p, 2022 8.5p, 2023 19.2p I defy anyone to say they can beat that on price on a dumb meter. currently 7p kWh for gas is low, since I had a new smart meter installed in October I'm averaging 4.9p that's a saving of £61. Since 2020 I have used over 8000kWh of electricity, during that time my total bill is -£1,220, and yes you did read that right on average they are paying me £300 a year more than I pay them, part of the reason my cost per kWh went up in 2023 was they paid me silly money to export on average 24.9P. I would however agree that on their own smart meters do not save money, what saves money is changing behaviour, but I would say the majority of people stick on a single rate tariff and so don't save grrrrrrrrrrr..................Can you point out to me, clearly a simpleton, which bit I don't understand?
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spiral
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Post by spiral on Jan 9, 2024 15:27:57 GMT
currently 7p kWh for gas is low, since I had a new smart meter installed in October I'm averaging 4.9p that's a saving of £61. Can I kindly ask how you generate a reduction in your gas tariff?
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keitha
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Post by keitha on Jan 9, 2024 19:35:06 GMT
Gas tracker, price changes daily
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Post by bracknellboy on Jan 9, 2024 19:45:47 GMT
Gas tracker, price changes daily do you know whether you can switch to only one of the tracker's and remain on standard for the other ? Specifcally, I'm interested in the electricity tracker but nervous about the gas tracker. Especially as I dont' see we have much control over our gas usage in terms of being able to turn down the wick on specific days. I looked the other day on the website (I'm a customer of the eight armed creature) and couldn't see that it obviously possible.
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keitha
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Post by keitha on Jan 9, 2024 22:32:05 GMT
yes i'm on gas tracker and Flux for electricity, give them a buzz and ask to be moved.
Gas is more of a gamble than electric I agree, if electric is high I could avoid using Dishwasher, washing machine etc, but if it's cold you have to run the heating. when we had the cold spell end of November, early December the price only hit 5.3p. the saving of £60 so far pays for a lot of days paying an extra 2-3p a unit
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Jan 9, 2024 23:31:46 GMT
yes i'm on gas tracker and Flux for electricity, give them a buzz and ask to be moved. Gas is more of a gamble than electric I agree, if electric is high I could avoid using Dishwasher, washing machine etc, but if it's cold you have to run the heating. when we had the cold spell end of November, early December the price only hit 5.3p. the saving of £60 so far pays for a lot of days paying an extra 2-3p a unit Do you get a situation where electricity's high, gas cheap ( "I'll do dinner on the hob instead of the oven") or vice versa ( "I'll turn the boiler off and put a fan heater/immersion on")?
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Post by bracknellboy on Jan 10, 2024 9:44:41 GMT
yes i'm on gas tracker and Flux for electricity, give them a buzz and ask to be moved. Gas is more of a gamble than electric I agree, if electric is high I could avoid using Dishwasher, washing machine etc, but if it's cold you have to run the heating. when we had the cold spell end of November, early December the price only hit 5.3p. the saving of £60 so far pays for a lot of days paying an extra 2-3p a unit thanks for this. we have of course gone quite a long way off route re. Car Insurance of course but nonetheless.... I noticed that Octopus has changed its algorithm for new customers with the effect of raising prices. What I noticed is that they are raising the standing charge for E by about 15% - which aligns it with the standard tariff - and also increasing by a fair bit the fixed delta on the wholesale price component. The latter has the effect of increasing the delta by 40% ish. Of course this is the change on the delta not on the aggregate, and amounts to an increase of 3p per kw/h. These figures are for South of England. Existing customers unaffected for the moment but will be brought into line. Does this materially impact your expectations etc. ? The other question I had was how you get notified about price. Is getting pricing effectively a 'pull' or is it setup to be 'push' ? I can imagine getting an SMS each day with the day's price, or a mobile notification would be very effective: don't put the washing machine on today ! Leave the hoovering for now ! But on the other hand, needing to proactively log into the app each day to check the pricing I can see would be far less helpful (for us).
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