star dust
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Post by star dust on Sept 1, 2015 10:39:24 GMT
As noted elsewhere the valuation for this pipeline loan has become available this morning. I am fairly certain it didn't have a loan number when I first spotted it, but it does now and appears as:= "Asset details Value Loan LTV Stage Valuation PBL54 - Land in Hull £3,250,000 £1,787,500 55% 4 Available " This is what usually happens just before a loan goes live, so if it goes live today it will be the first test of the pre-funding model. I think I may also have misinterpreted savingstream 's suggested refinement of it, and maybe the valuation/details 'available' being live will be our prompt to set/re-set our pre-funding targets with a 48hr grace period in case we missed it. In which case it is a relief that it is far simpler than I anticipated in my initial response, a much more elegant refinement. However, I stand to be corrected on all this  . In Edit: oh got it all wrong ..... Have changed thread title as the loan has lost it's number, if it ever goes live I'll change it again! 7 Sep - it's got it's number back! |
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Liz
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Post by Liz on Sept 1, 2015 10:54:04 GMT
Great spot and a massive step forward. Just reading it.
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Liz
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Post by Liz on Sept 1, 2015 11:07:20 GMT
High risk of flooding, no planning, and no direct road access to A road. If I saw this on assetz or TC im sorry to say I would pass.
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Post by mrclondon on Sept 1, 2015 11:08:20 GMT
Well spotted !
And a timely reminder that I really don't want a piece of every SS loan however easy the pre-funding model is. Having had clients both sides of the Humber Estuary (and having lived in Grimsby for 18 months Monday to Friday), I really can't see the attraction of this parcel of land with the inherent flood risks at £130k/acre [For those with a short memory google hull floods]
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2015 11:17:23 GMT
Think I'll pass on this one.
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mv
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Post by mv on Sept 1, 2015 11:17:57 GMT
It has been raining rather a lot recently....(not with P2P investment opportunities I might add!)
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Post by duncandive on Sept 1, 2015 11:58:23 GMT
Valuation Issues No planning consents in place Located in an area considered a high risk flood area. Hmmmm I agree that maybe this would be one to miss.. So now I guess that I have to cancel my 'Pre-funding' option/comitment. Bit of a pain if they then also list other more agreable loans at the same time... Edit; after doing a little more reading on this one, I have changed my mind and so my p-fund is back on. 92% is a pretty good level to receive on going Live 
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Post by supernumerary on Sept 1, 2015 12:24:32 GMT
These are the points I have noted from the report;
"The site comprises a fairly level development site totalling 10.14 hectares (25.05 acres) which adjoins a mixed retail and trace counter park (more detail provided in description section within main report document below)."
"The site is located adjusted to the St Andrews Quay Retail development comprising a mix of trade counter/wholesalers and retail warehouses along with fast food restaurants, pubs and a petrol station. Occupiers include B&Q, Marko, McDonalds, Frankie & Benny’s, Benson for Beds, DFS, Halfords and Laura Ashley amongst other national operators."
"25 SUITABILITY AS MORTGAGE SECURITY
We are of the opinion that, subject to comment within this report, the property offers security suited
to your purpose and intended loan facility assuming a suitable loan top value ratio is maintained.
We consider the commercial strengths and weaknesses of the property at the date of valuation to
be:-
Strengths
Adjacent an established retail park
Immediately available;
Prominent large site just off A63.
Weaknesses
Considered a high risk flood area;
No dedicated access road directly from A63."
I am sure Saving Stream will have reviewed the suitability of this venture, so it is up to each individual lender. I will be lending on this one.
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Sept 1, 2015 13:03:01 GMT
Access road isnt an issue as there is vehicular access from the adjacent retail park which is probably the most likely route in anyway (surely not going to stick another junction so close to the existing one).
Flooding is the key for me, looked at the map for the recent warnings and there's one bit highlighted in red along the whole of that side. No prizes that shopping by canoe is a realistic scenario.
Prefunding now off.
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Post by savingstream on Sept 1, 2015 13:25:26 GMT
These are the points I have noted from the report; "The site comprises a fairly level development site totalling 10.14 hectares (25.05 acres) which adjoins a mixed retail and trace counter park (more detail provided in description section within main report document below)." "The site is located adjusted to the St Andrews Quay Retail development comprising a mix of trade counter/wholesalers and retail warehouses along with fast food restaurants, pubs and a petrol station. Occupiers include B&Q, Marko, McDonalds, Frankie & Benny’s, Benson for Beds, DFS, Halfords and Laura Ashley amongst other national operators." "25 SUITABILITY AS MORTGAGE SECURITY We are of the opinion that, subject to comment within this report, the property offers security suited to your purpose and intended loan facility assuming a suitable loan top value ratio is maintained. We consider the commercial strengths and weaknesses of the property at the date of valuation to be:- Strengths Adjacent an established retail park Immediately available; Prominent large site just off A63. Weaknesses Considered a high risk flood area; No dedicated access road directly from A63." I am sure Saving Stream will have reviewed the suitability of this venture, so it is up to each individual lender. I will be lending on this one. We are content with the suitability of this asset as mortgage security but have made allowances in the low LTV. It is owned by a very wealthy and experienced developer with a substantial Assets and Liabilities position hence has the resources to refinance if necessary at the end of the loan term.
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Sept 1, 2015 13:42:44 GMT
Putting my dunce cap on, the thing that makes me uncomfortable about this one is that whilst I have an inherent understanding of flooding risk (as do we all), I really can't quantify it. When you mix that into site development risk, and what a potential flood might do to a construction project......
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brush
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Post by brush on Sept 1, 2015 14:10:41 GMT
If it is any use, flood report by Hull City Council. Hull City Council Flood Investigation Report - CMIS > Home cmis.hullcc.gov.uk/.../Document.ashx?... Feb 4, 2014 - 03 04/02/14 Final for scrutiny SW/AC SW/AC/E&I OSC .... details had not been established at the time of the flood event on the 5th. December. ... river Hull through to the St Andrews Quay site and into the city centre with a. Apologies not happening. Google and it will appear |
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webwiz
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Post by webwiz on Sept 1, 2015 16:44:37 GMT
So all you who are giving this a miss are of the belief that if there is a loss on this loan only the investors in the loan will be affected? I thought this was still an unresolved issue.
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Post by supernumerary on Sept 1, 2015 17:34:02 GMT
We are content with the suitability of this asset as mortgage security but have made allowances in the low LTV. It is owned by a very wealthy and experienced developer with a substantial Assets and Liabilities position hence has the resources to refinance if necessary at the end of the loan term. I have been doing some ‘research’, but please it isn’t meant to be exhaustive and complete. It is just my research and I am not employed by Saving Stream. From this website; hullcc-consult.limehouse.co.uk/portal/planning/frm/flooding_investigationsFlooding Investigations Since the widespread floods of 2007, there have been several other occurrences of flooding in the city, each of which was investigated by the Council. The reports into these events are available below. 25th August 2012 Heavy Rain 5th December 2013 Tidal Surge 10th August 2014 Heavy Rain If you look at the two attachments I have posted, you will see that it was ONLY during a tidal surge on the 5th December 2013 that St Andrews Quay Retail Park was affected. I have taken some time to snapshot the pages and size them into the attachments. PLEASE NOTE the following. According to my reading of the reports and I stand to be corrected; [1] ONLY two properties were affected on St Andrews Quay Retail Park according to the report into the 5th December 2013 Tidal Surge. [2] NOTE that there were THIRTEEN properties affected on Kingston Retail Park according to the report into the 5th December 2013 Tidal Surge. Where is Kingston Retail Park in Hull? Look at this map; encrypted.google.com/maps/dir/St+Andrews+Quay+Retail+Park,+Clive+Sullivan+Way,+Hull,+United+Kingdom/Kingston+Retail+Park,+Hull,+Kingston+upon+Hull/@53.7351768,-0.3688393,15z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0x48789565ba6f495d:0xc38895fab4564d85!2m2!1d-0.3720244!2d53.72821!1m5!1m1!1s0x4878be287ce727b3:0x3f30785b47a094d1!2m2!1d-0.3447881!2d53.7387934 According Google Maps Kingston Retail Park is 2 miles away from St Andrews Quay Retail Park. Further information about St Andrews Quay Retail Park can be found here; cushwake.completelyretail.co.uk/media/investment_case_study/23/Hull---St-Andrew-s-Quay-Hull---06.2010.pdfPLEASE NOTE – The above document reveals a valuation of the St Andrews Quay Site of £82,000,000. Now having looked at this, I might put even more money in as a lender. However, it is for everybody to decide their own tolerance of risk. I hope that is helpful to you all.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2015 22:26:20 GMT
Looks High risk.
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